#linuxcnc | Logs for 2018-07-09

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[00:07:20] <CaptHindsight> https://milwaukee.craigslist.org $2200
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[00:40:14] <`Wolf> 0.o anything interesting going on…
[00:41:31] <XXCoder> not much
[01:01:20] <`Wolf> https://www.sorotec.de perfect for a micro VMC build lol
[01:01:49] <XXCoder> I read it as 820,000 bucks lol
[01:01:57] <`Wolf> lol
[01:01:58] <XXCoder> annoying with . and , standards
[01:02:09] <`Wolf> yeah
[01:03:03] <XXCoder> you EU people should port over to . for decimals and , for break
[01:03:07] <XXCoder> ;)
[01:03:27] * `Wolf isn’t in the EU
[01:03:51] <XXCoder> lol assumed that from DE country link you linked
[01:04:09] <`Wolf> i’m 30 min outside of Washington DC lol
[01:05:12] <`Wolf> was just watching https://www.youtube.com saw the tool changer on his 24k spindle and thought about a conversation from last night lol
[01:05:46] <XXCoder> thats pretty small mill
[01:06:22] <`Wolf> like I said, micro VMC or something of the sort lol
[01:06:43] <XXCoder> two of his 123 blocks is in rough shape lol
[01:06:46] <`Wolf> even horizontal setup
[01:07:53] <`Wolf> *rewatches
[01:08:27] <`Wolf> I was fussing around with some stuff and missed that lol
[01:08:56] <`Wolf> I think those blocks are diy
[01:09:08] <`Wolf> probably hardened but not ground yet
[01:09:25] <XXCoder> hmm maybe
[01:10:02] <`Wolf> said he had been working on them for a few years
[01:12:29] <pink_vampire> `Wolf: in what sec?
[01:12:43] <`Wolf> eh?
[01:13:13] <pink_vampire> where do you see the tool changer?
[01:13:58] <`Wolf> he shows the puller unit and mentions building a tool holder rack
[01:14:04] <`Wolf> at some point
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[01:14:47] <pink_vampire> 12:40
[01:14:50] <pink_vampire> i see
[01:14:53] <`Wolf> I didn’t know that bt/cat type tool holders came in that small of a size
[01:15:03] <pink_vampire> but what ATC is that?
[01:15:33] <pink_vampire> is is part of the spindle or an add on?
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[01:15:54] <`Wolf> add on
[01:15:56] <`Wolf> I linked it
[01:16:22] <`Wolf> https://www.sorotec.de
[01:17:06] <pink_vampire> is there something like that that go on ER 11?
[01:17:25] <`Wolf> no idea, I was going WTF when I saw it
[01:18:25] <pink_vampire> https://www.sorotec.de
[01:18:31] <pink_vampire> this is the spindle?
[01:18:49] <`Wolf> I think is
[01:19:04] <`Wolf> the links are in the video description
[01:19:07] <pink_vampire> 0.8Kw??
[01:19:54] <`Wolf> yeah thats over 1hp… i think
[01:20:09] <pink_vampire> I'm with one 2 times more power, and i cant force it in to the material without good coolant.
[01:21:12] <`Wolf> german watts vs china watts?
[01:21:14] <`Wolf> idk
[01:21:17] <pink_vampire> `Wolf: it is 1hp *only* in max rpm. the torque on low speed is very low.
[01:21:43] <`Wolf> actually its 0.8Kw peak at 6,000rpm
[01:22:10] <`Wolf> goes down to just above 0.7Kw @ 24000
[01:22:22] <pink_vampire> I love my spindle, the hf is a game changer.
[01:23:02] <`Wolf> http://www.sorotec.de
[01:23:04] <pink_vampire> but only if you are using very small endmills
[01:23:26] <`Wolf> yeah, HF shines with smaller sizes
[01:24:53] <`Wolf> this figures, I want to make a bracket from 7075 but all I have is round stock =/
[01:25:25] <pink_vampire> if you can push your original spindle to about 6000 rpm, it will be much better then whatever hf.
[01:25:45] <`Wolf> I don’t have any machines like that
[01:26:16] <`Wolf> just big semi chunky knee mill with max of 3180rpm
[01:26:17] <pink_vampire> i'm talking normal endmills, for stuff smaller then 1/8" sure go hf,
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[01:28:00] <pink_vampire> but i think the 2.2K or 3K china made ones is a good spindle replacement, the 0.8K is only good as aux spindle.
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[01:28:41] * `Wolf honestly knows nothing about high speed spindles
[01:29:07] <pink_vampire> and it is not a big fun to go between spindles to do one job. keep that in mind.
[01:29:29] <`Wolf> I do know that I want to replace the motors on my mill and lathe with brushless servos tho
[01:30:34] <`Wolf> I keep milling stuff at wrong spindle speeds because I don’t feel like messing with the belt
[01:32:48] <pink_vampire> I think at the end of the day, if you need prismatic parts with good finish on them, you must use the whole endmill flute length, and that mean torque, but for organic shape, or none critical diminutions parts, yeah, the HF will do the trick.
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[01:35:34] <pink_vampire> `Wolf: you need to calculate your feed based on the spindle speed and your chip load. if you go the other way around you will melt your tools without very good coolant.
[01:35:38] <`Wolf> right now I just make ugly parts for my own stuff
[01:36:11] <`Wolf> yeah, thats what I usually do, run feeds and speeds calc w/ set spindle speed
[01:36:15] <pink_vampire> i'm sure 100% it is not related to your spindle speed.
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[01:37:42] <pink_vampire> if you are getting ugly cut, with the hf, it is going to be just worse, more rpm = more vibrations = more heat = poor finish.
[01:37:56] <`Wolf> https://imgur.com
[01:38:01] <`Wolf> no hf here
[01:38:29] <`Wolf> https://imgur.com the round part was last nights project
[01:40:38] <pink_vampire> the cuts look good to me, you can add a radius to your fly cutter and get even better finish, but other than that, just use larger fly cutter and face the whole plate in one pass.
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[01:41:05] <`Wolf> the mini pallet plate is saunders machine works
[01:41:28] <pink_vampire> did you pay for it?
[01:41:33] <`Wolf> yeah
[01:41:38] <pink_vampire> lol
[01:41:40] <pink_vampire> why
[01:41:45] <`Wolf> he sells them for $89
[01:41:51] <pink_vampire> O_O
[01:42:14] <`Wolf> because my pos micro mill cnc I wouldn’t trust to make 150 holes that all line up
[01:42:14] <pink_vampire> just made one.
[01:43:09] <pink_vampire> who care if they lined up, it is a thread for a bolt.
[01:43:21] <`Wolf> really not bad price for that many holes, all threaded and reamed for dowel pins
[01:43:47] <`Wolf> they are 1/2 depth reamed for 1/4”, bottom 1/2” threaded
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[01:44:21] <pink_vampire> i just made one myself
[01:44:27] <pink_vampire> + mini clamps.
[01:44:38] <`Wolf> i’ll be making my own clamps
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[01:45:09] <`Wolf> also going to make a couple round pallets for the rotary table and lathe
[01:45:55] <pink_vampire> i did mine with 10-32 screws.
[01:46:09] <`Wolf> but the 6”x8” plate, the cost for same size stock off eBay was $35 so just ordering it made no big deal
[01:47:53] <pink_vampire> I'm uploading some pictures
[01:48:11] <`Wolf> https://imgur.com you can see the dowel pins
[01:49:27] <pink_vampire> i'm just use it in the vice, and the vice jaw is my straight edge
[01:49:56] <`Wolf> yup that works
[01:50:33] <`Wolf> I have a few things I want to make with odd geometry so this makes that easy
[01:52:13] <pink_vampire> just rotate your coordinate system parallel to your vise jaw
[01:52:22] <`Wolf> manual mill
[01:52:46] <`Wolf> no 2.5D milling =)
[01:52:52] <pink_vampire> https://i.imgur.com
[01:53:03] <pink_vampire> https://i.imgur.com
[01:53:12] <pink_vampire> https://i.imgur.com
[01:54:45] <`Wolf> looks good
[01:55:10] <`Wolf> if I ever bother to finish the X2 cnc, I’ll make a pallet for that thing
[01:56:19] <pink_vampire> did you saw the sine plate?
[01:56:28] <`Wolf> no
[01:57:17] <pink_vampire> i will make an album, one sec.
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[02:24:29] <IchGucksLive> morning from germay
[02:24:48] <IchGucksLive> sun is up in full force
[02:24:59] <IchGucksLive> expecting 30+ degC today
[02:30:33] <IchGucksLive> off 2 garden
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[02:58:57] <Deejay> moin
[03:05:12] <`Wolf> morning
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[03:15:47] <pink_vampire> `Wolf: https://imgur.com
[03:17:51] <norias> hi pink_vampire
[03:18:15] <pink_vampire> hi norias
[03:18:35] <`Wolf> nice work
[03:19:49] <norias> oh, i see what you did
[03:19:51] <norias> clever
[03:20:09] <pink_vampire> did you read the comments about the HF spindle?
[03:20:21] <`Wolf> pink_vampire: I would show a pic of my lathe but I’m sure you’ll give me hell for the mess around it lol
[03:21:08] <pink_vampire> my lathe is a MESSS right now
[03:21:22] <XXCoder> oh yeah! hows new lathe so far??
[03:21:34] <pink_vampire> XXCoder: AMAZING!
[03:21:35] <XXCoder> last I heard you just completed rebuild
[03:21:46] <XXCoder> nice :)
[03:22:08] <pink_vampire> XXCoder: look here https://imgur.com
[03:23:28] <`Wolf> https://i.imgur.com I need to build a new base for the table and move the lathe 2” towards the front so I can put a chip shield behind it
[03:24:02] <XXCoder> you have a sine plate. nice
[03:24:11] <XXCoder> such a handy thing to have eh
[03:24:24] <pink_vampire> i have also a sine bar.
[03:24:42] <`Wolf> also need to make a bracket for the tail stock drop
[03:24:47] <`Wolf> drop/DRO
[03:25:03] <XXCoder> funny thats exactly same part (but different sizes) I had to remove and flip around to fix my indictor arm
[03:25:24] <XXCoder> very nice
[03:25:34] <XXCoder> love your series of pictures
[03:25:47] <pink_vampire> `Wolf: look better then my lathe right now
[03:26:04] <pink_vampire> XXCoder: thanks
[03:26:20] <XXCoder> both of yours is betetr than mine. my router is still in closet :( simply no room
[03:27:01] <`Wolf> I’m slowly finding room for everything
[03:27:11] <`Wolf> I still have tooling sitting in the other room
[03:27:25] <XXCoder> if I get rid of some junk, I MIGHT be able to fit cnc router in closer in such way it can run lol
[03:27:28] <pink_vampire> just get rid of the bed / tv
[03:27:31] <XXCoder> but doubtful
[03:27:37] <XXCoder> I dont own any tv
[03:27:54] <`Wolf> also still have parts to make so I can use everything with the lathe lol
[03:28:19] <pink_vampire> XXCoder: just put it in a drawer
[03:28:35] <`Wolf> need to make a tool post nut so I can use my tool post grinder
[03:29:05] <`Wolf> and need to make something for all the tailstock stuff before they roll off the table
[03:29:15] <XXCoder> even my router may be small but dang thats one big drawer if it could fit it lol
[03:29:47] <pink_vampire> I have a T slot table on the late, so maybe..
[03:31:03] * `Wolf has too much tooling (not really)
[03:31:24] <`Wolf> one drawer of just C5 collets…
[03:31:46] <pink_vampire> 5c collets are nice,
[03:32:22] <`Wolf> need to cut this out, I wish I had a higher wattage laser https://i.imgur.com
[03:32:23] <pink_vampire> my lathe take L20, those are 50$ each (if you can find one)
[03:33:15] <pink_vampire> is that a holder for gauge pins?
[03:33:21] <`Wolf> and that still leaves 2 boxes of larger emergency collets
[03:33:28] <`Wolf> thats for my C5 collets
[03:33:46] <`Wolf> fills almost a full drawer of the kennedy box
[03:34:15] <pink_vampire> i have just 4 :-(
[03:35:27] <`Wolf> Im usually only using c5 on the lathe, this is a rare moment that the chuck is in it
[03:36:32] <pink_vampire> but i'm using 4 jaw independent, 99% of the time,
[03:38:08] <`Wolf> I have two 3 jaws, a 4 jaw and a 3 jaw buck chuck that needs a backplate
[03:38:14] <pink_vampire> maybe i need to get a square 5c collet block and use that in the chuck. I'm sure it will be much cheaper then a set of L20
[03:38:28] <`Wolf> could work
[03:38:56] <`Wolf> may be able to put a c5 closer on it
[03:39:10] <`Wolf> whats the spindle mount on that thing?
[03:39:43] <pink_vampire> what do you mean?
[03:40:08] <`Wolf> how does your chuck mount
[03:40:32] <pink_vampire> on a thread
[03:41:13] <pink_vampire> you just screw it on and then use some compression ring on it.
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[03:42:27] <`Wolf> http://www.shars.com + a backing plate w/ the thread for your lathe spinde nose then
[03:43:20] <`Wolf> block is cheaper though lol
[03:43:34] <pink_vampire> that is not a bad idea at all.
[03:43:46] <pink_vampire> and I have an extra back plate.
[03:44:11] <pink_vampire> but I think it is 4"
[03:45:01] <pink_vampire> actually I want the 8mm collets, over the C5 they soo cute.
[03:45:32] <`Wolf> https://i.imgur.com are cheap
[03:45:48] <pink_vampire> no, i was wrong, it is 5"
[03:47:31] <`Wolf> fugues I have 2 hex… which doesn’t help you much
[03:47:39] <`Wolf> figures*
[03:49:44] <pink_vampire> I will go with 5c only if I will find a alot of them cheap, because a set can go to 300$..
[03:49:56] <`Wolf> yup
[03:50:03] * `Wolf got lucky
[03:51:26] <pink_vampire> and for most stuff you can just bore some aluminum and cut a slot with the HF and you are good to go
[03:55:33] <`Wolf> true, just make your own bushings
[03:56:33] <`Wolf> C5 w/ collet closer shines when you’re making more then one piece
[03:57:18] <pink_vampire> true..
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[04:10:41] <`Wolf> always figures, whatever size stock I need, I have 1/2” smaller
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[04:13:59] <pink_vampire> I have only 1" brass and few 3/8" brass, and i think 3/4" steel from lowes (junk)
[04:14:21] <Lcvette> log
[04:14:21] <c-log> Lcvette: Today's Log http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81
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[04:14:56] <`Wolf> i needed a 84mm round, have 76mm/3”
[04:15:30] <pink_vampire> so you must go 4"?
[04:16:24] <`Wolf> 3.5”
[04:16:33] <pink_vampire> cool
[04:16:36] <`Wolf> I’ll just order a chunk from eBay
[04:16:58] <pink_vampire> you mean for the back plate
[04:17:10] <`Wolf> no this is for something else
[04:17:24] <`Wolf> I have like 5 projects in the works at one time lol
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[04:17:59] <pink_vampire> me too
[04:18:11] <pink_vampire> never finish any LOL
[04:18:27] <`Wolf> lol
[04:18:44] <`Wolf> I was looking at my x2, I really want to get it running so I can cnc parts with it
[04:19:10] <pink_vampire> what is the issues that you have?
[04:19:24] <`Wolf> that its all in pieces
[04:19:50] <`Wolf> I ordered it as loose parts from little machine shop
[04:20:19] <pink_vampire> you mean the conversion kit?
[04:20:29] <`Wolf> no the whole mill
[04:21:11] <`Wolf> bare column, head casting, spindle housing, micro mill extended travel base kit x/y
[04:22:53] <pink_vampire> what so special about it?
[04:23:48] <`Wolf> https://i.imgur.com
[04:24:05] <`Wolf> which I just pulled it alll apart again
[04:24:22] <pink_vampire> but why??
[04:25:05] <`Wolf> need to clean up the ball nut mounting, stepper mounts, drill and tap a bunch of holes in it
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[04:25:59] <_abc_> Hi. Can anyone please recommend a simple desk edge vise / vice 2-3in size, low cost (<50EUR), and precise enough for finer manual work?
[04:26:12] <_abc_> This is for occasional use, no need to go overkill.
[04:26:17] <pink_vampire> `Wolf: just do it..
[04:26:30] <`Wolf> thats the plan pink =)
[04:27:07] <`Wolf> it is funny seeing it next to this knee mill, my vise is the same size as the whole table on the x2
[04:27:28] <_abc_> I'll lurk for answers, thanks.
[04:28:04] <`Wolf> best bet is to check eBay or amazon or who ever sells tools around you imo
[04:28:07] <pink_vampire> _abc_: I LOVE the small emco that i have. find something used on ebay, take it a part, clean it, and re assemble. and it ill be amazing,
[04:29:37] <_abc_> Emco is a recognized name yes.
[04:29:44] <_abc_> How much should I pay for it?
[04:30:02] <pink_vampire> _abc_: https://imgur.com scroll here down. you will see them.
[04:30:03] <_abc_> A ball swivel vise would be nice but it has to be solid. I seldomly do anything thicker than 5-8mm
[04:30:41] <`Wolf> I would say panavise but thats going to blow out that 50EUR figure
[04:30:47] <pink_vampire> _abc_: I save them from going to the trash, they was look hopeless.
[04:31:00] <`Wolf> unless you find one on eBay used
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[04:31:18] <_abc_> You mean the machinist's vise on your mill/lathe?
[04:31:38] <pink_vampire> yes
[04:31:48] <_abc_> Used is good, I am just fed up with crap which is un-fixable even with major rebuild.
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[04:32:05] <pink_vampire> https://i.imgur.com
[04:32:10] <pink_vampire> those
[04:32:55] <_abc_> https://www.amazon.com this looks okayish but upper end of price scale.
[04:33:02] <_abc_> I assume knockoffs are not good, right?
[04:33:03] <`Wolf> _abc_: something like https://i.imgur.com
[04:33:29] <pink_vampire> _abc_: you want to do machining on that O_O
[04:33:44] <`Wolf> pink he said desk vise =)
[04:34:06] <XXCoder> that picture is very visually confusing. lol
[04:34:24] <pink_vampire> okkk
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[04:34:31] <XXCoder> took me bit to see that screw isnt parallel with base lol
[04:34:34] <`Wolf> lol ya lot of crap on that bench
[04:34:45] <XXCoder> screw looks like its been threaded on other side of U
[04:35:04] <XXCoder> which makes left and right disagree visually lol
[04:35:06] <`Wolf> its centered down the U
[04:35:07] <pink_vampire> I got mine from HF for 19$ or so..
[04:35:27] <pink_vampire> work fine as bench vise.
[04:35:45] <`Wolf> I got that beast of a thing because I do circuit board repair
[04:35:50] <XXCoder> `Wolf: if you took picture at slightly different angle it would be even worse illusion lol
[04:36:02] <`Wolf> probably XXCoder
[04:37:32] <`Wolf> panavise are really good IMO
[04:37:33] <pink_vampire> https://www.harborfreight.com
[04:37:49] <pink_vampire> I got them wayyy cheaper.
[04:38:55] <`Wolf> I would call that a work bench vise, work ok unless you’re really wrenching on something, would end up broke in my shop
[04:39:35] <`Wolf> then again most things break when you put over 500 ft/lbs to them
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[04:40:57] <pink_vampire> I had to remove the spring so i will be able to move the handle freely..
[04:42:11] <`Wolf> I have one of these styles http://a.co broke the nut off inside of it
[04:43:18] <pink_vampire> for 299 you can get a real vice. not a bench ones.
[04:45:42] <`Wolf> it was a real vise…
[04:45:59] <pink_vampire> i mean machinist vice.
[04:46:20] <`Wolf> oh, $300 will almost get a nice machine vise
[04:47:53] <pink_vampire> I'm using the bench type for stuff that will abuse the nice machine vise, like hammering, use the torch, bending, and stuff like that.
[04:49:19] <pink_vampire> and since i have a small emco. I never use the large machining vice,
[04:49:34] <`Wolf> true, I won’t do anything that will mess up the machine vise on my mill
[04:49:47] <`Wolf> that damn thing cost too much to screw up
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[04:51:20] <IchGucksLive> hi all
[04:51:43] <pink_vampire> the only time I'm using the machine vise not for machining is to press stuff. because they go to 10K lbs,
[04:51:51] <pink_vampire> hi IchGucksLive
[04:52:34] <IchGucksLive> hydraulik chucks
[04:53:11] <IchGucksLive> good use for bending steel also
[04:53:57] <pink_vampire> https://i.imgur.com
[04:54:00] <RyanS> those modular vices cost a fortune
[04:54:37] <pink_vampire> extracting a Jacob taper that was really on it.
[04:55:19] <IchGucksLive> some head
[04:55:24] <IchGucksLive> heat
[04:56:06] <IchGucksLive> i use ice cooler for the tap and a flame solder for the chuck and it workes perfect
[04:56:12] <pink_vampire> IchGucksLive: what do you mean?
[04:56:49] <IchGucksLive> to get it apart
[04:57:47] <`Wolf> stick the taper in ice, heat the chuck with a torch
[04:58:18] <`Wolf> other way is to use taper U wedges like you are suppose to to pop it apart
[04:58:24] <IchGucksLive> you need to firat ice the taper for a while only the cone
[04:58:52] <IchGucksLive> thats the cone spare for
[04:59:16] <pink_vampire> it was 5 sec, with the impact wrench
[04:59:28] <IchGucksLive> it also shoudt have a 10mm spare to the chuck itsefl
[05:00:00] <pink_vampire> the pictue is after the taper come out.
[05:00:16] <`Wolf> that doesn’t work with a albrecht
[05:00:17] <IchGucksLive> so a wedge driver goes in
[05:00:44] <`Wolf> need http://a.co
[05:00:45] <pink_vampire> `Wolf: how that work?
[05:00:47] <IchGucksLive> lots of good idees are on that
[05:01:14] <`Wolf> the albrecht doesn’t have a hole in it
[05:01:21] <IchGucksLive> im off
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[05:02:08] <pink_vampire> `Wolf: I took the taper off to find out the size.
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[05:03:31] <`Wolf> should have been on the chuck
[05:05:00] <`Wolf> its also stamped on the MT to jacobs taper shank
[05:05:04] <pink_vampire> the same model came with several sizes of tapers.
[05:06:33] <pink_vampire> i wanted to use that on the mill, but it wasn't the right size.
[05:08:47] <`Wolf> I love the albrecht chucks that came w/ the machines I got, but on the mill sometimes it feels like its a foot long
[05:09:52] <pink_vampire> i love small chucks or using a collet
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[05:10:28] <`Wolf> yep, lot of times i use my er32 collets (because I have a full set of them)
[05:10:52] <`Wolf> I need to break down and get a er16 set
[05:10:56] <pink_vampire> with the HF is a problem. because the largest shank is 1/4" or 6mm..
[05:11:52] <pink_vampire> if you need to drill holes it is just not fun,
[05:12:18] <pink_vampire> it force you to use 1/8" shank drills
[05:12:37] <`Wolf> ugh, that sounds annoying
[05:13:27] <`Wolf> problem I run in to with my stuff is the er32 and monster 1/2” drill chuck won’t fit where I need to drill
[05:13:50] <pink_vampire> you want to use your 1/2" tap guide.. opss not gonna happen
[05:14:11] <`Wolf> and the 5000 drill bits I have are all screw machine size
[05:15:41] <pink_vampire> if you know about a drill chuck that will work at 20K rpm without expending, that will be nice.
[05:18:05] <`Wolf> at that speed, I would stick with collets lol
[05:18:42] <pink_vampire> the spindle can go 3 times faster..
[05:19:15] <pink_vampire> and then the chuck .....
[05:20:33] <pink_vampire> there is 2 problems.
[05:20:47] <pink_vampire> cnc NEVER cut round holes.
[05:21:30] <`Wolf> sure it will
[05:21:43] <`Wolf> if you use a boring bar
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[05:21:59] <pink_vampire> er11 collets for letter size drill bits and numbers drill just not gonna happen in normal price.
[05:22:43] <pink_vampire> `Wolf: boring number 11 drill?
[05:23:07] <`Wolf> actually, er11 will hold a size range not just what its listed as
[05:23:32] <pink_vampire> do you want to test it in 60K?
[05:24:15] <pink_vampire> if it vibrate, this is the end of your spindle taper. and you must re grind it.
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[05:28:33] <`Wolf> http://content.penturners.org example, but all ER collets actually have a clamping range
[05:29:47] <`Wolf> so right now I use the ER32 for anything odd sized, because I have a full set in 1/32” steps
[05:30:14] <norias> hmmm... er32
[05:30:23] <pink_vampire> i know they have range, but it is not optimal.
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[05:30:34] <norias> did you ever try the ball bearing collet nuts, Wolf?
[05:30:40] <`Wolf> nope
[05:30:50] <norias> i recommend them
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[05:31:02] <`Wolf> I’ll have to check it out then
[05:31:02] <pink_vampire> norias: what it "bearing collet nuts"??
[05:31:10] <norias> i set up a machine with those and one of the torque wrenches to get consistent torque
[05:31:16] <norias> it was the bees knees
[05:31:24] <norias> pink_vampire: i'll find a link
[05:31:31] <pink_vampire> thanks
[05:32:18] <`Wolf> I was using the hell out of the ER32 with my 7xJunk lathe with the ER32 adapter mounted to it
[05:32:27] <norias> http://www.shars.com
[05:32:54] <`Wolf> my 12x37 has a C5 closer and a full set of collets to now I rarely touch the er32
[05:33:09] <norias> basically, the ball bearing collet nuts claim less pullout
[05:33:19] <norias> which, from my experiments, seems to be true
[05:33:24] <norias> slightly better runout, too
[05:33:44] <norias> new collets + ball bearing collet nuts + torque wrench
[05:33:49] <norias> made a lot of difference
[05:33:57] <norias> that was on a Haas VF-3
[05:34:25] <`Wolf> I won’t notice it on my machine but thx for the heads up =)
[05:34:39] <pink_vampire> LOL VF3
[05:34:43] <`Wolf> knee mill maxes out at 3100
[05:35:16] <pink_vampire> norias: we have mills, not VMCs
[05:35:37] <norias> what's wrong with a VF-3?
[05:35:54] <pink_vampire> the price tag.
[05:35:57] <norias> lol
[05:36:25] <pink_vampire> and the fact I can't put in my apartment.
[05:36:31] <norias> i guess if that's the worst you can say about them
[05:36:37] <norias> but that was why i mentioned it
[05:36:47] <norias> i recognize that's not what everyone is working with here
[05:36:55] <norias> so my suggestions might not be useful
[05:37:20] <pink_vampire> here we "hope" to make parts.
[05:37:50] <`Wolf> go figure they stop at ER16 for the ball bearing nuts
[05:37:51] <norias> right on
[05:38:04] <`Wolf> so no help for the ER11 spindle units
[05:38:09] <norias> ahh, ok
[05:38:34] <norias> i'd imagine though, that the advantanges don't help you on er11 stuff
[05:38:45] <norias> better off just replacing collets on a regular basis
[05:38:53] <norias> i consider collets to be consumables
[05:39:18] <pink_vampire> we are using the cutting edge technology of 1960
[05:39:27] <`Wolf> 24000rpm on them ER11 spindles
[05:39:37] <`Wolf> would probably help some
[05:41:52] <`Wolf> just need the SK10 ATC for them spindles lol
[05:42:42] <pink_vampire> `Wolf: you are going to have bout 1 tau runout, and don't ecpect better then that on the cheap spindles and collets. but no one care, it dust the material much faster then you think
[05:43:15] <norias> hmmm
[05:43:30] <pink_vampire> so yeah, it will cost you more endmills, but the run time will be 10-20 times faster.
[05:43:32] <`Wolf> yeah, runout just wears the tools faster
[05:43:45] <norias> runout does other things too
[05:43:50] <norias> especially with small endmills
[05:44:11] <`Wolf> true, I forget about that
[05:44:33] <`Wolf> most stuff I do small is under 3/16” lol
[05:44:36] <pink_vampire> but on 60K the endmill also flex.
[05:44:39] <norias> i'm constantly reminded
[05:45:05] <norias> keep in mind your chip thickness is effected by runout
[05:45:10] <norias> affected
[05:45:27] <`Wolf> were we talking about mini horizontal desktop machine the other night?
[05:45:30] <norias> the smaller the end mill, the less chip thickness, the greater percentage of the affect
[05:45:32] <norias> we were
[05:46:01] <`Wolf> https://www.sorotec.de https://www.sorotec.de
[05:46:13] <`Wolf> can give it tool changer like a real sized one lol
[05:46:33] <norias> yeah, i've been looking at a few spindles
[05:46:54] <norias> i actually think i can up with a cool way to do tool changes, tbh
[05:47:18] <pink_vampire> norias: true, and i'm using mostly 1/8" 1/16" 1/32" and I'm taking full slotting pass with all the and mills.
[05:47:43] <norias> pink_vampire: yeah, well, full slotting not so much of a runout problem in that regard
[05:48:11] <pink_vampire> the main problem it coolant
[05:48:24] <norias> what are you cuttin?
[05:48:24] <pink_vampire> steel just self ignite
[05:48:31] <`Wolf> I just have visions of a desk top cnc the size of a large microwave with the wheel full of mini tooling like the hass machines have
[05:48:38] <pink_vampire> any material
[05:48:53] <norias> wolf: see, i don't like the haas tool changer at that size of machine
[05:49:01] <norias> too many moving parts / space consumption
[05:49:14] <`Wolf> yeah very true
[05:49:39] <`Wolf> the chain magazine systems look better, kinda
[05:49:43] <pink_vampire> `Wolf: you don't need a ATC with er11
[05:49:53] <norias> i was actually thinking something like the shopbot
[05:49:58] <norias> just vertically oriented
[05:50:06] <XXCoder> norias: lol work has 2 office mills. its so tiny it could fit in my closet. it has tool changer
[05:50:21] <pink_vampire> you are going to use metric drills, and tools with 1/8" shank ALL THE TIME
[05:50:22] <norias> XXCoder: the haas office mill?
[05:50:33] <XXCoder> 14 tools I think, and its size of dinner plate around cyyler
[05:50:36] <XXCoder> yeah
[05:51:09] <pink_vampire> XXCoder: you meant to the CM1?
[05:51:17] <`Wolf> what does the shopbot use? pick and place type holder?
[05:51:18] <norias> well, i'm thinking about designing / building a machine
[05:51:29] <norias> so i want to reduce part count / complexity
[05:51:48] <norias> Wolf: yes
[05:52:19] <pink_vampire> `Wolf: no way you need ATC on the X2
[05:52:35] <pink_vampire> waste of money.
[05:52:47] <XXCoder> norias: https://www.youtube.com
[05:52:51] <`Wolf> if I do one its going to be a pick and place with the TTS junk
[05:52:52] <XXCoder> welcome to world of shitty machine
[05:53:08] <pink_vampire> it take 1 sec to replace the tool, if you stick to 1/8" collet anyway,
[05:53:08] <XXCoder> if you look at it wrong, it breaks something
[05:53:36] <norias> pink_vampire: the whole thing i want to do is experiment with lights out machining
[05:53:46] <norias> tool changer is definitely a requirements
[05:53:56] <`Wolf> and the X2 will be using normal sized endmills, I can run anything up to 3/4 inch
[05:54:08] <XXCoder> only postive I can say about haas om2 is insane rpm. very nice cuts when something isnt broken and messing cut up
[05:54:13] <`Wolf> un-attended tool change is good
[05:54:35] <norias> i feel like the machine can be crappy
[05:54:48] <`Wolf> needed if the cycle time is slow even IMO
[05:54:52] <norias> as long as it tool changes and _maybe_ has a pallet changer
[05:55:03] <`Wolf> so you don’t need to stand there and wait for tool change
[05:55:12] <XXCoder> really depends on usercase wolf. haas om works fine for rare use or at home
[05:55:17] <XXCoder> for production forget it
[05:55:18] <norias> but in reality, i'm like a year out from buying a machine
[05:55:25] <norias> i think
[05:55:35] <norias> i probably have a lot of software crap to do first
[05:55:49] <pink_vampire> `Wolf: you need to make 20 parts in one shot. and then replace the tool.
[05:56:16] <`Wolf> I’ll probably skip the ATC, still putting air piston for the drawbar release tho
[05:56:34] <XXCoder> pink more times part is placed and removed on fixture higher chance there is scrap
[05:57:03] <XXCoder> and some features should be made at same placement as some other features of part
[05:57:15] <XXCoder> lower chance of misalignment
[05:57:32] <pink_vampire> XXCoder: i mean to make a setup for alot of parts, and cut all of them.
[05:57:33] <`Wolf> ^ I try to aim for minimum setups when doing anything
[05:57:54] <norias> Wolf: my goal is always two in a mill
[05:58:11] <norias> do one side, flip, done
[05:58:14] <`Wolf> yup
[05:58:30] <norias> i dig carrier machining
[05:58:43] <`Wolf> cut soft jaws and a machine that can repeat = golden
[05:58:57] <norias> or a nice fixture
[05:58:59] <XXCoder> wolf record at work is hmm 10 setups I think. had to be done that way because roughing, bake, one side lathe, other side lathe, milling, 3 sides (3 rotations of part) then go off to paint, come back and lathe both sides, then finally 2 final mill jobs
[05:59:04] <XXCoder> then its finally packed and sent off
[05:59:21] <`Wolf> ugh sounds like a pain in the ass
[05:59:38] <XXCoder> that part is huge huge huge pain in ass. it takes months. good thing I never run those.
[05:59:50] <`Wolf> lol
[05:59:51] <pink_vampire> norias: https://i.imgur.com https://i.imgur.com https://i.imgur.com
[05:59:54] <XXCoder> its 200 parts also lol
[06:00:29] <norias> pink_vampire: what is this?
[06:01:19] <XXCoder> probe thing
[06:01:26] <pink_vampire> the I don't care what is the tool length, the cnc will find it.
[06:01:49] <XXCoder> is that tool length probe?
[06:01:56] <pink_vampire> https://i.imgur.com
[06:01:59] <pink_vampire> correct.
[06:02:17] <XXCoder> oh yeah! forgot I saw that completed project
[06:02:18] <`Wolf> I’m thinking about doing a laser tool setter
[06:02:20] <norias> hah. cool.
[06:02:36] <XXCoder> `Wolf: theres one that does laser for "rough measurement" then touchoff
[06:02:46] <XXCoder> I think I linked you that before
[06:02:51] <`Wolf> https://i.imgur.com
[06:02:53] <`Wolf> yeah
[06:02:53] <pink_vampire> `Wolf: 2 spindles electronic datum..
[06:02:58] <XXCoder> the demo is scary as hell at end lol
[06:03:06] <XXCoder> rapid stright to very top of jaws
[06:03:11] <norias> i was playing with using tool probes to do "broken tool" detection
[06:03:17] <norias> lasers can be good for that, too
[06:03:26] <XXCoder> norias: its seriously wonderous to have that.
[06:03:33] <`Wolf> yup and cheap on eBay cause no one know what to do with them lol
[06:03:50] <norias> XXCoder: yeah, i dig it.
[06:04:23] <`Wolf> I think i have <$20 in to that laser and read heads
[06:05:05] <pink_vampire> https://www.instagram.com
[06:05:26] <pink_vampire> I just saw that.
[06:05:59] <norias> haha
[06:06:11] <`Wolf> oops lol
[06:06:18] <norias> dumbass
[06:06:21] <XXCoder> dumbass didnt do dry run jeez lol
[06:06:27] <norias> try a shorter vise next time
[06:06:42] <norias> it would have been fine without that tall vise
[06:06:46] <pink_vampire> he add -100 instead of +100
[06:07:07] <`Wolf> … can’t say much, I have done that
[06:07:17] <`Wolf> mdi the wrong axis
[06:07:28] <norias> yeah
[06:07:32] <norias> oh, so...
[06:07:41] <norias> i'm a supervisor at a machine shop
[06:07:46] <norias> and the one guy...
[06:07:51] <norias> most of the machines are manual
[06:07:51] <`Wolf> watch the x1 micro mill break a 3/8 end mill and throw the part out of the vise
[06:07:53] <pink_vampire> my vise can tell you..
[06:07:55] <XXCoder> sure mistakes can happen, just need to be really careful with talking some stuff
[06:08:01] <norias> and one guy is slated to learn CNC
[06:08:13] <norias> he made all his parts for the shift
[06:08:21] <norias> i literally had nothing left for him to make
[06:08:30] <norias> so i said, "go figure out how to turn the cnc on"
[06:08:47] <norias> keep in mind, i've run lots of cnc machines, just never this particular one
[06:08:58] <norias> so, we play around with mdi
[06:09:08] <norias> just moving axii around
[06:09:27] <norias> i had to go do something, so i left him alone with the instruction to not break anything
[06:09:39] <pink_vampire> https://www.instagram.com
[06:09:40] <norias> i come back... machine is on the hard stop in the x axis
[06:09:50] <norias> he's freaking out
[06:10:16] <norias> i told him these things happen to everyone, no biggie
[06:10:18] <XXCoder> pink ow that picture... machine is ruined
[06:10:33] <norias> it took a while, but we found this button added to the control cabinet
[06:10:46] <norias> something like "X axis reset" scribbled in marker
[06:10:53] <norias> so, i press the button
[06:10:56] <`Wolf> lol always a good sign
[06:10:57] <norias> everything turns on
[06:11:07] <norias> but only while i am holding the button
[06:11:17] <norias> i say, "ok, hold this button for a minute"
[06:11:34] <norias> then i walked over and jogged the machine off the hard stop
[06:11:37] <pink_vampire> norias: here most of us build / convert out machines. so stuff like that are not very common here
[06:12:07] <norias> well, to be fair, this was a cnc conversion
[06:12:19] <norias> it's just... the machine is 20 ft. tall
[06:12:55] <XXCoder> lol
[06:13:03] <pink_vampire> LOL
[06:13:03] <XXCoder> one of those pallet loader type cnc machines?
[06:13:09] <XXCoder> horzional mill?
[06:13:39] <norias> horizontal boring mill
[06:13:41] <norias> floor type
[06:14:02] <pink_vampire> cat50 taper?
[06:14:19] <XXCoder> fancy 5 axis making aluminium top hat lol
[06:14:27] <norias> pink_vampire: yeah
[06:14:51] <`Wolf> I almost got a cat40 machine for my home shop…
[06:14:59] <norias> the place i work now has the biggest machine's i've ever seen
[06:14:59] <XXCoder> dont know how to get single entry link
[06:15:13] <norias> i think the travel on one of them is like 30' in the X
[06:15:18] <`Wolf> damn
[06:15:19] <norias> and 50' in the Y
[06:15:34] <XXCoder> oh https://www.instagram.com
[06:15:51] <`Wolf> lol that machine travel is larger then my house
[06:16:00] <norias> every part is moved by crane
[06:16:05] <XXCoder> wow!
[06:16:12] <norias> and sometimes the 50 ton crane isn't enough
[06:16:14] <XXCoder> whats you guys make in it??
[06:16:21] <XXCoder> whole cars? :P
[06:16:38] <norias> rolls for steel mills
[06:16:53] <norias> sometimes ancillary equipment or rolling stand components
[06:17:25] <norias> we actually have train tracks that run in to the facility
[06:17:37] <norias> so stuff can be hoisted on to a train
[06:17:39] <XXCoder> https://www.instagram.com interesting. flame to polish
[06:17:41] <norias> for shipping
[06:18:08] <XXCoder> heh place I work at is tiny compared to that
[06:18:27] <XXCoder> shop is larger but could maybe fit half of machines in your giant one
[06:18:57] <norias> yeah
[06:19:09] <norias> we have like 700,000 sq.ft under roofs
[06:19:17] <norias> and all of it covered by overhead cranes
[06:19:25] <norias> i think there are 30ish cranes
[06:19:33] <XXCoder> crazy
[06:19:37] <XXCoder> boeing?
[06:19:45] <norias> no
[06:19:56] <norias> Whemco Steel Castings
[06:20:28] <`Wolf> lol, almost local to me
[06:20:43] <XXCoder> cool
[06:20:51] <norias> Wolf: where are you?
[06:21:01] <`Wolf> Frederick, MD area
[06:21:05] <norias> ahh
[06:21:12] <norias> you have some nice shops down that way
[06:21:18] <norias> i see advertise for people
[06:22:03] <`Wolf> all sorts of weird stuff down here being close to DC
[06:22:07] <pink_vampire> did you have cnc fail?
[06:22:45] <norias> pink_vampire: eh?
[06:23:00] <pink_vampire> cnc fail video / pics?
[06:23:35] <norias> oh, naw
[06:23:38] <norias> sorry
[06:24:00] <pink_vampire> I'm trying to login to my instagram
[06:24:10] <pink_vampire> I have one that is funny
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[06:36:13] <pink_vampire> XXCoder: `Wolf: https://www.instagram.com
[06:36:44] <XXCoder> pushing a little hard lol nice and sparky
[06:37:15] <`Wolf> I did something like that when cutting a lathe tool holder down
[06:38:05] <pink_vampire> 0.1mm depth of cut, you can't go more then that. it is very springy steel.
[06:38:11] <`Wolf> everything looked good in the speeds and feeds calc
[06:38:35] <`Wolf> damn scary cut tho, wasn’t sure if the holder was hardened
[06:39:24] <pink_vampire> also the holes are not round as fuck
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[06:41:17] <pink_vampire> but i think it was because I've used G64 P0.05
[06:43:35] <jthornton> morning
[06:44:21] <pink_vampire> jthornton: morning
[06:45:04] <pink_vampire> jthornton: https://www.instagram.com
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[06:58:10] <pink_vampire> norias:
[06:58:22] <norias> pink_vampire:
[06:58:35] <pink_vampire> this is the video https://www.instagram.com
[06:59:06] <norias> fourth of july is over
[06:59:45] <pink_vampire> lol
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[07:09:34] <XXCoder> lol
[07:09:54] <XXCoder> new idea: july 4th milling show
[07:10:05] <XXCoder> lots sparks with shit tools and very sparky materials
[07:10:12] <XXCoder> different materials for different colors
[07:12:03] <pink_vampire> actually the tool is very good USA made, the cut is just very small so it ignite
[07:12:32] <XXCoder> I know, it was just idea from your sparky machining, not suggestions :)
[07:12:55] <XXCoder> just delibrate "show" by cnc tool and material :)
[07:13:49] <pink_vampire> I'm still use that end mill.
[07:14:13] <XXCoder> like block of iron, block of titanium, and hmm what makes blue sparks? whatever material third one heh
[07:14:23] <XXCoder> and tiil switches between em to change chip colors
[07:14:52] <pink_vampire> i never try titanium
[07:15:00] <XXCoder> titanium is weird
[07:15:14] <XXCoder> tools live pretty good for such a hard metal if proper se
[07:15:14] <pink_vampire> aluminum just melt on the endmills
[07:15:52] <XXCoder> BUT you could break tools if not careful. as well as chips could be set on fire and make very very hot fire. get metal fire type D fire exuster for that
[07:15:58] <XXCoder> or youre stuck with fire you cant stop
[07:17:04] <pink_vampire> there is not alot of metal to go on fire.
[07:17:14] <pink_vampire> it is just the micro chips
[07:17:19] <XXCoder> Ti can be set on fire and make super hot fire
[07:17:30] <XXCoder> coworker set sample of chips on fire and dang
[07:17:51] <XXCoder> not as bad as umm what that metal name. oh yes! Mg, or magensium
[07:18:02] <pink_vampire> you mean to burn it with a torch?
[07:18:24] <XXCoder> yeah though if youre unlucky enough to set it off in machine it can be very nasty
[07:18:39] <jthornton> morning
[07:18:42] <XXCoder> its not easy to start Ti on fire but dang
[07:19:19] <XXCoder> anyway in case of that low chance I HIGHLY recommand getting type D fire stopper
[07:19:51] <XXCoder> https://www.youtube.com
[07:20:47] <XXCoder> as you can see its bit hard to set on fire but dang bright when its going
[07:21:18] <pink_vampire> ho about nickle alloy?
[07:21:28] <XXCoder> https://www.youtube.com even more when its dust lol
[07:22:00] <XXCoder> hmm dont know about nickel, I ran inocel but never tested its flammability. I highly doubt it is, because its made for inside jet engine!
[07:23:52] <XXCoder> btw apparently prop planes production have ended.
[07:24:01] <XXCoder> of course theres smaller customer ones but larger yeah
[07:24:52] <pink_vampire> prop planes!
[07:25:10] <XXCoder> propellear cant spell that word worth a damn
[07:26:27] <pink_vampire> I know,
[07:26:33] <pink_vampire> but did you make them?
[07:26:40] <XXCoder> nah
[07:26:45] <XXCoder> just end of era
[07:28:41] <pink_vampire> I mean before it end, did your facility machine them?
[07:28:49] <XXCoder> oh not likely
[07:29:06] <XXCoder> we make bunch of boeing planes parts but none of em is prop
[07:31:06] <pink_vampire> did you machine silver nickel?
[07:31:12] <XXCoder> nope
[07:31:28] <XXCoder> I tend to run either Al or Inocel
[07:32:27] <pink_vampire> it is like combine brass sheet (the non machinable) with 304 SS
[07:32:59] <Deejay> inconel :)
[07:33:13] <XXCoder> I always spell that wrong
[07:33:43] <pink_vampire> how hard is to cut it?
[07:33:53] <XXCoder> it eats tools. lol
[07:34:00] <pink_vampire> like cutting HSS?
[07:34:21] <XXCoder> 1/16 ball endmill engraving, carbide, it engraves only 30 parts before it goes dead
[07:34:57] <pink_vampire> so it's hard, or abrasive?
[07:35:09] <XXCoder> general machine its like stainless steel maybe, very had
[07:35:14] <XXCoder> hard so it breaks tools
[07:38:01] <pink_vampire> what are you doing with it most of the time?
[07:38:10] <XXCoder> engraving lol
[07:38:24] <pink_vampire> engraving??
[07:38:30] <XXCoder> I hate enjraving those parts.
[07:38:33] <XXCoder> yeah part #
[07:38:37] <XXCoder> its a requirement
[07:38:45] <pink_vampire> what about laser it?
[07:39:03] <XXCoder> dunno dont think laser can do it? there is specifications BAC on legability
[07:40:41] <pink_vampire> Im sure the machine put more stress then laser
[07:42:30] <XXCoder> dunno they say I do it that way I do it that way :)
[07:42:59] <XXCoder> im production shop worker, not gig job machinist after all
[07:43:23] <pink_vampire> https://www.epiloglaser.com
[07:43:35] <pink_vampire> fiber laser can make it.
[07:45:53] <XXCoder> probably but shop dont have one
[07:47:03] <pink_vampire> but other then engraving, did you know how to machine it?
[07:47:22] <XXCoder> well I dont program parts so basically, no
[07:56:27] <`Wolf> glory of cnc operator life, hit cycle start, wait for crash?
[07:57:21] <XXCoder> sometimes lol
[07:57:32] <XXCoder> some parts is a... huge grind
[07:57:43] <pink_vampire> `Wolf: LOL!
[07:57:46] <XXCoder> runtime less than couple minutes, lots labor to change parts
[08:08:40] <jthornton> nice every time I open a tab in firefox it crashes
[08:09:10] <pink_vampire> opera?
[08:09:10] <jthornton> launch a new window and it crashes lol
[08:09:24] <XXCoder> did you recently update firefox?
[08:09:24] <jthornton> <jthornton> nice every time I open a tab in firefox it crashes
[08:09:35] <jthornton> I think it did yea
[08:09:42] <XXCoder> if so, you have to completely close firefox and open again for you to be able to open new tabs and windows
[08:09:50] <XXCoder> its been like that few versions
[08:10:57] <jthornton> that's stupid
[08:11:44] <XXCoder> it is.
[08:34:22] * skunkworks likes chrome..
[08:34:53] <skunkworks> wow - it has been a while - but I installed a different rom on my phone. So much nicer so far
[08:35:57] <skunkworks> (Actually found out my wifes old phone had a boot loader that wasn't locked. (same model as mine - just different boot loader) so now I am using her old one.
[08:38:13] <skunkworks> a little chunk of cast (about 5"X7"X10")
[08:38:14] <skunkworks> http://electronicsam.com
[08:48:56] <Sairon> oi
[08:48:59] <Sairon> that was a nice nap
[08:49:07] <Sairon> it seems like i don't sleep anymore
[08:49:10] <Sairon> just take random naps
[08:50:03] <Sairon> gimmee fuh gimmee fuh gimmee dabajabazaa!
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[10:37:11] <Loetmichel_> skunkworks: THAT blade has seen better days ;)
[10:58:22] <hazzy-lab> skunkworks: Is that a Roll-In?
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[11:17:58] <IchGucksLive> hi
[11:19:52] <hazzy-lab> hello Ichs
[11:22:45] <IchGucksLive> ;-)
[11:31:32] <skunkworks> hazzy-lab: ROLL-IN?
[11:35:23] <IchGucksLive> imoff till later
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[11:36:55] <hazzy-lab> skunkworks: I thought your bandsaw looked like a roll-in, but I guess not :)
[11:36:57] <hazzy-lab> http://www.rollinsaw.com
[11:37:00] <skunkworks> hazzy-lab: the table on the bands saw? air assisted
[11:37:04] <skunkworks> it is a jet
[11:37:21] <hazzy-lab> Ah, ok!
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[11:41:19] <hazzy-lab> We have a hydraulic assisted vertical in the ME shop as school, problem is it feeds at whatever speed you set it, no matter the cutting force. Air assisted would be much more forgiving, probably would save a lot of blades, lol
[11:46:41] <skunkworks> it is a little harder to get the right speed. (stalling the blade is common)
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[11:58:05] <enleth> https://youtu.be I wonder if that guy has no idea what he's doing or that lathe is really that badly designed it requires the operator to climb on top of it
[11:59:48] <enleth> (at 4:50)
[12:00:33] <`Wolf> might be just for visibility
[12:00:57] <`Wolf> and no qctp? what a pos
[12:01:02] <enleth> that too
[12:01:15] <enleth> but he's definitely not standing in a spot that was designed for it
[12:02:48] <`Wolf> poor design imo
[12:03:21] <hazzy-lab> skunkworks: The old DoAll don't stall :D In the wee hours one night somebody managed to shear/chew the flanges that keep the blade from pushing off the back of the wheels off by trying to feed to fast. When I replaced the wheels I saved the old ones for making a bandsaw log mill, hehe, somebody has to gain
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[12:52:30] <`Wolf> hmm, I wonder how bad a $22 ER16 11pc collet set from amazon can be…
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[12:53:27] <IchGucksLive> hi
[12:54:57] <fragalot> Heya
[12:55:05] <fragalot> Wolf__: Quite bad. :-)
[12:55:23] <IchGucksLive> Wolf__, can you please change the nick it is hard to tab you
[12:55:37] <`Wolf> one review that I now can’t find said 20 thou runout
[12:55:37] <IchGucksLive> wolf '
[12:56:07] <`Wolf> yeah I need to fix that, I have ZNC installed but I haven’t set it up yet
[12:56:15] <IchGucksLive> 'wolf they can have realy bad runouts
[12:56:24] <`Wolf> I’m logged in from 3 computers lol
[12:56:24] <fragalot> Wolf__: .5mm.. you've got spindle indexing right?
[12:56:34] <IchGucksLive> ER16 i got from CN got mashine shaking at 8krpm
[12:56:38] <fragalot> because that's large enough to compensate for in software, lol
[12:57:08] <fragalot> turn it into a reverse boring tool, where the goal is to have the tool centered rather than offset
[12:57:08] <`Wolf> nope, only reason I want them if for drilling when I can’t fit a chuck in the machine
[12:57:25] <IchGucksLive> Wolf__, there are precice at 6USD
[12:57:32] <IchGucksLive> 0,003
[12:58:33] <`Wolf> I won’t bother with trying the dirt cheap with actual endmills
[12:59:05] <IchGucksLive> drills longer then 1" will maybe flycut
[12:59:21] <`Wolf> but 20 thou sounds more like not in the nut proper
[12:59:44] <IchGucksLive> i got a packege 50pcs 3.2mm drills and 10 now are like a hook
[12:59:52] <IchGucksLive> melting like butter
[13:07:45] <IchGucksLive> im off for Today Gn8 from the old german guy
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[13:23:52] * Loetmichel_ just ate a bit more than 2 lbs of grilled meat... had to grill it because it was close to "best before" (pre-marinated meat vacuum sealed planned for a grill session yesterday that didnt happen)... "in an emergency the meat tastes well without any sides" ;)
[13:24:15] <`Wolf> lol
[13:24:23] <`Wolf> hey gloops
[13:24:35] <gloops> evening
[13:25:00] <`Wolf> that mill you linked from eBay yesterday, thats a seig x2 similar to what I’m building up
[13:25:02] <Loetmichel_> *boooarpssss*... now a beer on that protein and fat intake ;)
[13:25:20] <gloops> really? oh i might keep an eye on it then, thanks
[13:25:33] <`Wolf> inside it is a 2 speed plastic gear set
[13:25:57] <jdh> replace broken gears with belt drive mod
[13:26:00] <`Wolf> usually breaks there, but you can belt drive convert it
[13:26:13] <gloops> it looked pretty sturdy for that kind of mill -dovetails and so on, but looked a bit tinny from the back
[13:26:34] <gloops> yeah would soon fix that up, probably sturdy the column up as well
[13:26:50] <gloops> it will probably go for the going rate in the end anyway
[13:27:02] <`Wolf> yeah the tilting column sucks
[13:27:02] <jdh> I had one for a few months. used it to mill the ballnut pocket on my g0704
[13:27:34] <`Wolf> mine is sorta a hybrid of parts lol
[13:27:44] <gloops> would only be for personal bits and bobs and hobby - not making anything for anyone else
[13:28:10] <`Wolf> https://i.imgur.com
[13:29:56] <gloops> that looks well on the way to working
[13:30:16] <`Wolf> def getting a 3” spacer between the base and column
[13:30:40] <`Wolf> right now its all apart, redoing the ball screw mounts
[13:30:48] <gloops> the seigs usually get a lot of interest, ideal for garage/cnc stuff
[13:31:12] <`Wolf> and I need to redraw the top cap for stepper mount
[13:31:45] <`Wolf> thats cause they are cheap, harbor freight grade
[13:31:45] <gloops> is the column sturdy enough ? only 4 bolts on a smallish plate to the base
[13:32:09] <`Wolf> I’ll find out lol
[13:32:28] <`Wolf> can’t be any worse then my X1 cnc
[13:32:33] <fragalot> my RF45 only has 4 bolts holding the column onto the base too
[13:32:52] <fragalot> if they mate properly (eg. no shims, but full surface contact), it's quite alright
[13:32:55] <`Wolf> I think my jet knee mill is held together with bondo
[13:32:56] <gloops> id be tempted to bolt the base to a heavy slab with a 2nd column bolted to the original, behind, some kind of beefing up anywa
[13:33:24] <fragalot> gloops: there are people that have a bracket on the top of the column going to the wall
[13:33:40] <fragalot> which I think is a very interesting concept if you're not concerned with thermal expansion :P
[13:33:44] <gloops> that would do a lot as well
[13:33:56] <`Wolf> I’ve seen people box the column as well
[13:34:10] <gloops> hmm, also shaking a sectional wall to bits heh
[13:34:28] <`Wolf> I can’t do that because I’ll have a ball screw running down the back side
[13:34:36] <gloops> Wolf it might be ok as it is, probably is for ally anyway
[13:35:18] <`Wolf> if I get the itch bad enough I can alway servo up the knee mill =)
[13:36:34] <gloops> someone else was here doing a seig, not seem him recently though
[13:37:04] <`Wolf> I remember seeing one post somewhere that the person took the column and bolted it to the table and used it to flycut the riser block lol
[13:38:03] <gloops> he might have scraped the table first lol
[13:38:19] <`Wolf> nope lol
[13:38:37] <`Wolf> not sure if great idea or really dumb
[13:42:15] <Rab> Looks like this is primarily of interest to overclockerz and/or minerz.
[13:42:37] <Rab> uhh wrong channel, sorry
[13:42:49] <Rab> Wrong network even.
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[14:00:01] <enleth> Loetmichel_: actually, you probably could keep it for a day longer after grilling it and maybe use it as a cold cut
[14:00:12] <enleth> Loetmichel_: OTOH, I'd probably have eaten it all myself
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[14:20:04] <MrHindsight> https://www.ebay.com Brushless Servo Motor 400W
[14:20:05] <MrHindsight> Adjustable speed 200-4500r/min
[14:24:16] <fragalot> MrHindsight: https://hobbyking.com brushless 2kW .. Just add an ESC and encoder :P
[14:24:51] <fragalot> or if you prefer water cooled https://hobbyking.com
[14:24:56] <`Wolf> but I want moar watts
[14:26:12] <`Wolf> that might be good for my drill press tho
[14:26:17] <fragalot> `Wolf: https://hobbyking.com
[14:26:23] <fragalot> 9.8kW
[14:26:56] <`Wolf> lol
[14:27:02] <MrHindsight> Max Amps: 90A
[14:27:15] <Loetmichel_> fragalot: they have an 11kw and an 13kw in stock there
[14:28:14] <`Wolf> 7650K rpm?
[14:28:23] <fragalot> `Wolf: yup
[14:28:36] <`Wolf> may need some gearing down
[14:28:39] <fragalot> low kv so it should have decent torque
[14:29:15] <Rab> Plus the minor detail of a 9800W 50V power supply.
[14:29:17] <roycroft> so to answer my question from last week, the price increases have started
[14:29:19] <roycroft> http://www.grizzly.com
[14:29:22] <MrHindsight> Max voltage: 18V Max current: 94A 1692VA
[14:29:24] <`Wolf> I’ll stick with the sewing machine motors
[14:29:25] <roycroft> note the 20% "tariff surcharge"
[14:29:33] <roycroft> er, "tariff fee"
[14:29:52] <Rab> Although there might be some salvage 48VDC telco stuff for cheap.
[14:30:02] <MrHindsight> buy uhmerican fuck yeah!
[14:30:12] <roycroft> grizzly are adding it to everything received from china after friday last
[14:30:30] <`Wolf> so, the whole catalog?
[14:30:42] <fragalot> Rab: very minor detail. it's obviously designed for burst loads, so just put on a bank of 14s Lipo's
[14:30:45] <fragalot> :D
[14:31:04] <roycroft> i'm willing to pay a bit more to support my local economy
[14:31:06] <MrHindsight> it's about time we put those Commie Capitalists in their place :p
[14:31:11] <roycroft> i always have been
[14:31:16] <roycroft> and the more local the better
[14:31:34] <roycroft> i'll pay a bit more to buy something in eugene than to get it from portland
[14:31:48] <roycroft> and i'll pay a bit more to get something from the northwest than from back east
[14:31:48] <Rab> Attn patriots: http://www.electromechano.com
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[14:31:56] <fragalot> I'll pay more to get something TODAY.
[14:32:08] <roycroft> but i can't afford to pay significantly more
[14:32:09] <fragalot> and I do pay more in local shops for the convenience
[14:32:23] <MrHindsight> fragalot: how much to get it yesterday?
[14:32:35] <fragalot> but I personally couldn't give a damn /where/ it's made as long as the quality of the product meets the standard I expect for the price
[14:32:49] <roycroft> i won't pay more to get less though
[14:32:54] <fragalot> MrHindsight: you mean like Amazon does where it pre-emptively ships things?
[14:33:01] <roycroft> i just had to replace a chest freezer that died after ~25 years
[14:33:11] <Loetmichel_> fragalot: "burst loads" as in 6 minutes "bursts"
[14:33:12] <MrHindsight> the problem with Chinaco motor ratings is finding out what the actual specs are
[14:33:13] <roycroft> i found the one i wanted at home depot
[14:33:20] <fragalot> Loetmichel_: add more batteries
[14:33:26] <MrHindsight> do you just derate by 30%, 50% or?
[14:33:28] <fragalot> Loetmichel_: and add more chargers :D
[14:33:28] <roycroft> and i found the same one at a locally-owned appliance dealer for $20 more
[14:33:44] <roycroft> i bought it from the local dealer, knowing that more of the money would stay in the local economy
[14:33:54] <roycroft> then the local dealer informed me when they were doing to deliver it
[14:33:56] <Loetmichel_> fragalot: i meant: they can take full power for surprisingly long periods of time before overheating
[14:33:56] <roycroft> the did not ask me
[14:33:57] <fragalot> MrHindsight: their rating system is vendor specific :P
[14:33:58] <roycroft> they informed me
[14:34:12] <fragalot> Loetmichel_: vortex cooler.
[14:34:12] <roycroft> and told me that they would never change that
[14:34:25] <MrHindsight> fragalot: how do I put a tool changer on a 5mm shaft?
[14:34:25] <Loetmichel_> you do dearate 50% for continous power though in that kind of model plane brushless outrunner
[14:34:26] <roycroft> i told them that home depot would schedule a 2 hour window for delivery, at my convenience
[14:34:47] <roycroft> and that if they can't do that as well i'm done with them
[14:34:47] <fragalot> MrHindsight: Easy.
[14:34:59] <roycroft> that's paying more and getting less
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[14:35:30] <fragalot> MrHindsight: https://www.sorotec.de <= plus an adapter
[14:35:33] <MrHindsight> are we referring to any trade partners as "Commie Bastards" again yet?
[14:35:51] <roycroft> "commie" is an utterly meaningless word
[14:35:53] <fragalot> (I accept NO claims if you bust it because it's not rated for 10kW throughput :P)
[14:36:00] <`Wolf> most of the major appliances were scratch and dent specials from best buy
[14:36:04] <roycroft> almost all economies on the planet are mixed economies
[14:36:09] <`Wolf> in my house
[14:36:17] <MrHindsight> roycroft: not if you're over 50 :p
[14:36:24] <roycroft> i am well over 50
[14:36:25] <Rab> roycroft, that is a reasonable standpoint as a consumer, but consider that HD has vastly more resources to throw at logistics.
[14:36:29] <roycroft> and i stand by what i just said
[14:36:36] <roycroft> or do you mean "under 50"
[14:36:38] <roycroft> as in iq?
[14:36:44] <MrHindsight> connotation vs denoation
[14:37:12] <MrHindsight> sorry to be so abstract, lets get back to making fun of specs
[14:37:30] <Rab> If the little guys can only schedule their relatively few deliveries at the customer's pleasure, they may operate at an unsustainable loss.
[14:37:36] <roycroft> rab: actually, home depot and the local store use the same outfit for deliveries
[14:37:37] * Loetmichel_ is considering buying two of these and putting them in my BMW E36 convertible... if the german roadworhty agency wouldnt have so much paperwork requirements to make that road legal... -> https://german.alibaba.com
[14:37:41] <`Wolf> I take off 1/3 for china wattage
[14:37:45] <Rab> roycroft, touche, never mind.
[14:37:58] <roycroft> everyone outsources appliance deliveries these days
[14:38:15] <roycroft> it's the contract they have with the delivery folks that matters
[14:38:21] <MrHindsight> fragalot: gee wilikers that is expensive (tool changer)
[14:38:27] <roycroft> and the local store obviously have a crappy contract
[14:38:46] <Loetmichel_> 650A per motor at 400V... fun stuff ;)
[14:38:50] <fragalot> MrHindsight: Welcome to European made items.
[14:38:59] <fragalot> ..welcome to? why did I say that
[14:39:07] <`Wolf> lol
[14:39:26] <MrHindsight> Monday is colorful metaphor day
[14:39:35] <`Wolf> someone needs to get that tool changer and build a scale sized VMC
[14:39:59] <fragalot> `Wolf: syyl's got that toolchanger on his router :P
[14:40:03] <MrHindsight> fragalot: that is a very cure tool changer however, now I want one
[14:40:09] <MrHindsight> cure/cute
[14:40:16] <roycroft> and if i'm honest, it was the smug, snotty way that the local stop told me "that will *never* change" that put me off more than their inability to schedule the delivery to my convenience
[14:40:22] <roycroft> shop, not stop
[14:40:32] <fragalot> MrHindsight: if you think the toolchanger is cute, look at the size 10 taper toolholders
[14:40:40] <Loetmichel_> but that spindle stuff with model plane motors works. Especially well if small scale... Been there done that: https://www.youtube.com
[14:40:48] <skunkworks> are there any android messenging apps that will login to a skype account (instead of using sype)
[14:40:57] <skunkworks> google is failing me
[14:41:12] <MrHindsight> fragalot: are these tools for children? or miniature people?
[14:42:42] <MrHindsight> skunkworks: you can message a Skype phone number
[14:42:42] <fragalot> MrHindsight: children are people too.
[14:42:51] <MrHindsight> almost people
[14:43:29] <fragalot> ha.
[14:43:35] <MrHindsight> they go through various stages, newborn, food returners, noise makers, pupils etc
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[14:44:05] <MrHindsight> it's an expensive hobby
[14:48:40] <MrHindsight> fragalot: what is the torque like on the <1k rpm end of those commie BLDC motors?
[14:49:08] <gloops> Belgium v France tommorrow, big job for little country to do lol
[14:50:14] <MrHindsight> commie/asian trading partner
[14:50:23] <fragalot> MrHindsight: your guess is as good as mine, mainly depends on how good your ESC is
[14:50:50] <fragalot> but to put it to a number, i'd say about a metric shit ton
[14:50:53] <MrHindsight> mine is excellent thank you
[14:51:12] <MrHindsight> mst/min?
[14:51:18] <roycroft> i'm waiting for boris vs. theresa
[14:51:21] <Rab> MrHindsight, I think you'd want to use encoder feedback to the ESC rather than relying on back-EMF.
[14:51:23] <roycroft> that will be a much more entertaining match :)
[14:51:46] <MrHindsight> I try to keep EMF in front
[14:51:51] <fragalot> MrHindsight: metric shit tons meter.
[14:51:57] <fragalot> -s
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[14:53:09] <fragalot> MrHindsight: https://www.goldenmotor.com <= 20kW 160Nm peak
[14:53:15] <MrHindsight> I've been storing my back EMF since i was 12, should come in handy some day
[14:53:18] <fragalot> 80Nm rated
[14:54:25] <MrHindsight> those are many times the price of the hobby motors
[14:54:36] <roycroft> is emf sequestering a thing now?
[14:54:55] <roycroft> and do you store it in caves?
[14:54:58] <fragalot> indeed, so.. say about a quarter/third the torque on the hobby ones?
[14:55:02] <MrHindsight> the jury is still out on that
[14:55:02] <roycroft> or salt mines?
[14:55:04] <fragalot> mainly because the size is so much smaller
[14:55:10] <Rab> Note that those motors include hall-effect sensors for the control loop, rather than relying on back-EMF.
[14:55:27] <MrHindsight> noted in pen
[14:55:31] <pink_vampire> hiii
[14:55:48] <MrHindsight> hah who would only rely on back emf, losers
[14:55:59] <fragalot> pink_vampire: figured out what you are going to make yet?
[14:56:12] <Rab> MrHindsight, hobby BLDC manufacturers?
[14:56:13] <fragalot> MrHindsight: I do in the controller i'm making for valve cont~orl :P
[14:56:17] <fragalot> control*
[14:56:17] <pink_vampire> lol no
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[14:57:34] <fragalot> i've even done a project waay back'in'the'day to do sensorless homing with steppers
[14:59:47] <pink_vampire> https://scontent-lga3-1.cdninstagram.com
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[15:04:21] <gloops> hmm, trying to think what that could be used for pink_vampire
[15:05:04] <gloops> and didnt once stray towards any kind of fetish activity
[15:05:08] <pink_vampire> gloops: it is someone crash his machine
[15:05:19] <gloops> ahh yes i thought so
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[15:21:19] <pink_vampire> https://www.instagram.com
[15:23:43] <gloops> i had a saw blade come loose on a diesel sawbench once, was an interesting few moments
[15:24:23] <pink_vampire> OMG
[15:24:43] <gloops> do i run, duck, try to stop it, wait till it runs out of juice
[15:25:27] <pink_vampire> it is just fly out?
[15:26:29] <gloops> no, nothing happened, the blade just ran free, fairly well behaved, after a while i just went back and stopped the engine
[15:26:58] <pink_vampire> i see.
[15:29:33] <pink_vampire> XXCoder: for you https://www.instagram.com
[15:34:55] <XXCoder> good morning
[15:34:56] <XXCoder> looking
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[15:43:10] <XXCoder> interesting looks like broke tool on part?
[15:43:36] <pink_vampire> it"s a 2" tool
[15:44:05] <hazzy-lab> Ouch!
[15:48:40] <pink_vampire> https://www.instagram.com I love this picture,
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[15:51:05] <XXCoder> wow looked smaller in picture. pictures got no sense of scale.
[15:51:12] <MrHindsight> fragalot: http://www.3ders.org
[15:51:53] <MrHindsight> a dispenser composed of multiple patterning drums (one per powder type) that selectively deposit fine powder
[15:52:02] <hazzy-lab> My brother almost put a 1/4" Jacobs chuck thru the enclosure on a haas. It was an office mill with the 40k spindle option, he was going to drill some holes at low speed but fat fingered the speed, he did not hit estop fast enough the the unbalanced chuck came off the arbor and flew like a bullet. It pierced the enclosure, but did not go thru
[15:53:33] <pink_vampire> this is why I add my HF spindle as AUX spindle to my low speed one.
[15:54:26] <pink_vampire> drilling/ facing / and stuff like that are much better on the low speed spindle
[16:01:28] <JT-Shop> yea amcrest is replacing the bad camera
[16:01:44] <andypugh> pink_vampire: I have a drill chuck that looks exactly like that. It’s a problem with self-tighening chucks and a very high torque spindle. They can self-tighten to destruction if the drill grabs.
[16:03:51] <pink_vampire> I think it is much safer to use a collet, only odd size drills go in my drill chuck.
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[16:47:50] <MrHindsight> why would anyone use back EMF for positioning control of a BLDC motor?
[16:48:21] <MrHindsight> besides maybe really low budget where poor accuracy s required
[16:48:37] <Rab> Because it doesn't require any additional sensors or wiring?
[16:49:26] <Rab> Re-read your question. You wouldn't want to use it for positioning control.
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[16:50:36] <Rab> But it's very commonly used with hobby BLDCs/ESCs for continuous rotation in one direction, e.g. quadcopter rotors.
[16:52:33] <Rab> That's my point about low-RPM torque. Back-EMF sensing ESCs don't perform so well at low RPMs, because there isn't much to sense. It's easy to stall or confuse them.
[16:54:48] <Rab> I have that type of motor on my small spindle and while it'll still turn at very low speeds, there's almost no torque. It's easy to defeate the ESC.
[16:56:01] <Deejay> gn8
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[17:57:32] <hazzy-lab> Rab: I saw a vid a while back where somebody demonstrated using a BLDC for position control, it was pretty impressive, for a BLDC
[17:57:41] <hazzy-lab> As you say they usually stall at low speeds and/or "loose steps" and have very poor toque, but some how he found a way to mitigate those problems
[17:58:11] <Rab> hazzy-lab, the ODrive uses BLDCs for positioning, but with an external encoder.
[17:58:29] <hazzy-lab> I want to say he was using a modified version of STMBL, but I can't find the vid now
[17:58:42] <hazzy-lab> He did not have an encoder
[17:59:09] <hazzy-lab> But I think he might have been sending some high frequency pulses thru it to detect pos
[17:59:51] <Rab> Hmmm, that's an interesting idea.
[18:00:20] <hazzy-lab> I remember thinking it was really clever what ever he was doing, i wish I could find it again
[18:03:26] <sync> HFI is pretty common if you want to have rotor feedback at low speeds
[18:22:47] <tjb1_> Anyone ever setup modbus on an arduino before?
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[19:56:16] <MrHindsight> tjb1_: https://github.com
[19:57:37] <MrHindsight> https://www.cooking-hacks.com
[19:58:10] <MrHindsight> Kludgudionos
[20:00:21] <MrHindsight> Rab: I went back and reread my question a few times. Can I stop now?
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[20:35:49] <Rab> MrHindsight, sorry, I meant to indicate that *I* had reread your question.
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[21:40:01] <hazzy-lab> rebecca: long time no see. Made anything with the router recently?
[21:40:19] <rebecca> hey :)
[21:40:30] <rebecca> nope, been working on a new router
[21:40:41] <hazzy-lab> excellent!
[21:41:42] <rebecca> with a 1400x1200x600 rail/ballscrew kit
[21:44:42] <hazzy-lab> very nice, you will enjoy that! No more having to machine parts in two setups (I think I remember you talking about having to do that)
[21:47:12] <rebecca> thanks! i hope so. i
[21:47:29] <rebecca> i'm kind of banking on bootstrapping a business with it
[21:48:24] <rebecca> had to take a hand trolley to the post office yesterday to haul back parts I had ordered. and that trolley was full!
[21:52:41] <rebecca> how is your machine going?
[21:55:11] <hazzy-lab> I love it when parts start arriving for a new project, i feel like a little child at Christmas. the post man always laughs at me being so excited, lol
[21:56:02] <hazzy-lab> I have not worked on my machine much, too many other projects, got a new project car and several other things that take up all my time :D
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[21:57:41] <hazzy-lab> Really all I have left is to finish the limit switches, but since it works as is the pressure is low to get them done
[21:58:30] <rebecca> oh just install them! it's nice to have limit switches :D
[21:59:15] <rebecca> i'm going to be testing my inductive proximity limits soon. found a module that should make interfacing with them nice and simple.
[22:01:46] <hazzy-lab> I should just put them on, but I have been playing with different switch types, the X has had 4 different setups on it so far, lol
[22:02:23] <hazzy-lab> I finally got some inductive proxy switches that seems good though
[22:04:48] <hazzy-lab> But the new rabbit hole I have been thinking about going down is adding a notched "ring" to the ballscrews and having the proxy switch sense on that, it might almost be as good accurate as homing to an index on an encoder ....
[22:06:19] <rebecca> cool :)
[22:07:30] <tjb1_> thanks MrHindsight, you ever used it?
[22:14:12] <MrHindsight> tjb1_: no I tend to use STM32 vs duinos
[22:14:26] <tjb1_> same functionality?
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[22:17:29] <tjb1_> It appears with modbus I can get inputs to the computer over USB
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