#linuxcnc | Logs for 2018-08-10
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[00:52:09] <fragalot> hi
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[01:10:02] <roycroft> i've been watching joe pieczynski videos lately
[01:10:07] <roycroft> he doesn't suck as a machinist
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[01:18:17] <fragalot> roycroft: he's got some good tricks up his sleeve
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[02:06:27] <roycroft> maybe by the time i'm 100 i'll be as good a machinist as he is
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[03:00:49] <Deejay> moin
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[05:44:31] <jthornton> morning
[05:50:12] <XXCoder> yo
[05:51:45] <jthornton> how did it go last night
[05:52:34] <XXCoder> hot.
[05:52:57] <XXCoder> I finally did full 10 hours of work though. I was pretty badly underperforming this week
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[05:57:14] <jthornton> not feeling well?
[05:58:08] <XXCoder> kinda, heat affects me poretty badly lol
[05:58:19] <XXCoder> plus one nasty job I have been running all week.
[05:58:31] <XXCoder> inocel part engraving. it kills tools so fast.
[05:58:34] <XXCoder> 900+ parts
[06:03:28] <jthornton> engraving with a 60° bit?
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[06:07:01] <XXCoder> lol no
[06:07:08] <XXCoder> 1/16 ball endmill
[06:08:06] <jthornton> do ball endmills wear out faster than normal endmills?
[06:08:41] <XXCoder> no way to compare, inocel is tool killer
[06:08:53] <XXCoder> I can do 1,000 parts thats on steel
[06:08:58] <XXCoder> inocel? 30 to 50
[06:09:16] <jthornton> wow that's a huge difference
[06:09:39] <XXCoder> yeah
[06:09:52] <XXCoder> you ever machined that metal? I know im mispelling it
[06:10:07] <XXCoder> inconel
[06:10:31] <jthornton> no, seems to me we had drill collars made from that in the oil field
[06:10:59] <XXCoder> its virtually immune to corrusion, very very high temperate range it can be in
[06:11:15] <XXCoder> parts im engraving I think would ve placed inside jet engine
[06:11:33] <XXCoder> lots corrosive chemicals as well as very hot
[06:11:55] <jthornton> is it heaver than steel?
[06:12:18] <XXCoder> yeah
[06:13:42] <XXCoder> its nickel based
[06:13:48] <XXCoder> so yeah tough mofo metal
[06:14:14] <XXCoder> I was pissed when they out-processed the part
[06:14:36] <XXCoder> otusiders dont know how damn sensive to thickness engraving is, as well as parallelism and smoothness of surface
[06:14:42] <XXCoder> because that metal is so hard
[06:14:43] <jthornton> that must be why they use it for drill collars a drill collar is a much heavier section of pipe with very thick walls that is placed at the bottom of the drill string
[06:14:58] <XXCoder> I sort parts to .0005" lots
[06:15:19] <XXCoder> you cant engrave 0 parts with -.0005 it could look bad or break tool
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[06:18:30] <XXCoder> yeah wouldnt be surpised
[06:19:00] <XXCoder> I think inconel is one of toughest metals out there
[06:19:09] <XXCoder> in terms of balance of toighness and brittleness
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[06:36:15] <XXCoder> jthornton: other one I was running was also inconel lol
[06:36:29] <XXCoder> its to turn ring into half ring. with tol of .002"
[06:36:44] <XXCoder> I ran 40 parts and it killed 1/2 cobolt endmill
[06:37:01] <XXCoder> I think its cobolt anyway, not usual color
[06:37:10] <XXCoder> kinda bluish
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[06:44:04] <jthornton> you guys don't use carbide endmills?
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[06:44:49] <XXCoder> we do
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[06:45:02] <XXCoder> most times. the ring cutting is very rough on tools
[06:45:14] <XXCoder> so we rough with cobolt then regular carbide for finish
[06:45:32] <XXCoder> if I recall right cobolt costs a lot more and are much tougher
[06:45:54] <jthornton> hmm didn't know that
[06:46:42] <XXCoder> http://www.endmill.com
[06:46:54] <SpeedEvil> Cobalt is tougher than normal HSS, but may deal with interrupted cuts better than carbide AIUI
[06:46:58] <XXCoder> most jobs its not worth it, but some jobs is just nasty to tools
[06:47:29] <XXCoder> I just wish there was cobolt 1/16 ball endmills
[06:48:09] <SpeedEvil> I'm sure there are. On the expensive shelf.
[06:48:19] <XXCoder> very expensive shelf
[06:48:24] <SpeedEvil> Or 'yes, we will grind that for you'.
[06:48:25] <XXCoder> one right at eyesight level
[06:49:05] <XXCoder> yeah not worth it I think. maybe it could do 100 to 200 parts wild guess, but cost more than it saves
[06:49:49] <jthornton> I used to sharpen nail point cutters and they were made of M42 IIRC
[06:52:23] <XXCoder> heh the engraving job used to be ok job, old fadal was slow
[06:52:32] <XXCoder> so i had plenty of time to sort part by sizes
[06:52:39] <XXCoder> but robo is so fast I barely have time
[06:53:49] <jthornton> you have to sort them by depth of cut?
[06:53:57] <XXCoder> part height
[06:54:08] <jthornton> ah that makes sense
[06:54:09] <XXCoder> metal is so hard it could break tool if too large difference
[06:54:18] <XXCoder> as well as it needs to be look good
[06:54:37] <XXCoder> engraving depth is around .002" to .003"
[06:54:56] <XXCoder> sometimes under and rerun, and sometimes over. not scrap but not recommanded
[06:55:01] <jthornton> chickens are standing at the door waiting for it to open
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[06:55:59] <jthornton> engraving a part number?
[06:56:30] <XXCoder> yeah
[06:58:03] <jthornton> too bad it doesn't have a laser height measuring tool to set Z0
[06:58:12] <XXCoder> or just probing
[06:58:20] <XXCoder> that'd make job go much faster
[06:58:35] <XXCoder> probably 30 tool swaps lol
[06:58:39] <XXCoder> and very sore arm
[06:58:51] <XXCoder> my current record is 750 parts in 10 hours
[06:59:10] <Laminae_> O.o
[06:59:18] <XXCoder> that was mere steel version of part.
[06:59:30] <XXCoder> carbide ball endmill last long time
[06:59:38] <XXCoder> and parts is nearly all alike so no sorting
[07:00:57] <Laminae_> I'm surprised there aren't more open source tool changers
[07:01:22] <XXCoder> no idea
[07:01:27] <Laminae_> jthornton: thanks for your help setup the other day
[07:01:40] <XXCoder> all ones at work is commerical, and my home one is single tool, no changer
[07:02:27] <Laminae_> I like the kern a lot because it is so simple
[07:02:40] <Laminae_> When the only tool you have is a...
[07:04:19] <jthornton> your welcome
[07:05:29] <Laminae_> Side note, now that i've successfully converted to linux cnc, i'm considering upgrading some components on my machine, specifically my actuators, the cbeam came with leadscrews which i'm not entirely happy with, and i think i could latterally swap them for ballscrews
[07:05:58] <Laminae_> I was kinda thinking these bad boys, any thoughts? https://www.ebay.com
[07:06:16] <XXCoder> built-in module eh
[07:06:28] <Laminae_> That's my current frame https://imgur.com
[07:06:40] <XXCoder> love how they have all same picture but different sizes
[07:07:13] <Laminae_> Yeah, it's surprisingly difficult to fint assemblies like that
[07:07:19] <Laminae_> find*
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[07:10:45] <fragalot> hey
[07:12:47] <XXCoder> yo
[07:17:01] <Laminae_> Any other recommendations xcoder?
[07:17:58] <XXCoder> not really
[07:18:02] <XXCoder> too tired to think
[07:18:09] <XXCoder> work have been a hot hell whole week
[07:18:20] <XXCoder> normally I could sit but this week I couldnt either
[07:18:55] <fragalot> hemorhoids? :P
[07:19:39] <XXCoder> nah arthitis
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[07:25:49] <XXCoder> fragalot: I was so busy I couldnt sit
[07:26:04] <XXCoder> normally I run a machine I can sit few minutes while its running
[07:46:18] <fragalot> XXCoder: look at how well the chipbreaker works on this thing. it's impressive... https://www.youtube.com
[07:50:10] <jthornton> lol debian 9 doesn't even have make or gcc installed
[07:50:19] <fragalot> why would it?
[07:50:28] <fragalot> it's just bloatware for the average user
[07:50:38] <jthornton> why not every other disto does
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[09:20:52] <hazzy-lab> jthornton: I assume you are using 2.8 (Vietnamese trans is not in 2.7). How did you install LCNC (buildbot?), and how do you launch the quick reference?
[09:24:28] <hazzy-lab> if have a rip install maybe rerun `make install-menus` ...
[09:27:46] <hazzy-lab> jthornton: assuming you use the app menu launcher for the Quick reference:
[09:28:05] <hazzy-lab> Open: /usr/share/applications/linuxcnc-gcoderef.desktop
[09:28:51] <hazzy-lab> and make sure the command line is: Exec=/usr/bin/x-www-browser /usr/share/doc/linuxcnc/gcode.html
[09:29:12] <hazzy-lab> (I assume it is /usr/bin/x-www-browser /usr/share/doc/linuxcnc/gcode_vi.html ....)
[09:31:15] <jthornton> hazzy-dev: yes 2.8
[09:32:05] * jthornton was only whining because debian does such a great job at making everything you try to do the most annoying frustrating difficult experience you can have
[09:35:30] <robotustra> I have an little bit offtopic question about debian/testing. When I plug a vebcam I see 2 devices /dev/video0 and /dev/video1. I can open and read only one device. What is the second device for? Is it a bug or feature?
[09:35:48] <skunkworks> hazzy-lab: I can jog the motor with servoterm. It is a little squirley..
[09:36:31] <robotustra> Does anybody face with the same situation?
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[09:48:29] <hazzy-dev> skunkworks: closed loop? Nice!
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[11:57:13] <hazzy-m> Anybody have any clue what this may mean?
[11:57:26] * hazzy-m uploaded an image: 20180809_231707.jpg (314KB) < https://matrix.org >
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[12:00:09] <cradek> Hardware event. This is not a software error.
[12:00:18] <cradek> CPU 0 BANK 0 TSC 1e79c70010
[12:00:24] <cradek> CPUID Vendor Intel Family 6 Model 42
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[12:00:49] <cradek> I did what it said and it told me a little more
[12:00:59] <cradek> your bardware is hroken
[12:01:23] <hazzy-lab> thank you cradek
[12:01:39] <Loetmichel> hazzy-lab: always the same core?
[12:01:52] <Loetmichel> or everytime a different one?
[12:02:28] <hazzy-lab> not sure, only had the error show up once, but the PC crashes routinely, most of the time starts up without error
[12:03:04] <Loetmichel> It LOOKS like a bad core
[12:03:16] <Loetmichel> could also be some faulty CPU socket though
[12:03:33] <hazzy-lab> ok, I hope it is the socket ...
[12:03:44] <hazzy-lab> this is basically a brand new machine
[12:04:06] <hazzy-lab> maybe the socked was not clean
[12:04:33] <Loetmichel> i dont think intel does still sell faulty CPUs with some cores disabled relabeled as "smaller" ones
[12:04:38] <hazzy-lab> thanks for the hints all, I'll pull the CPU and see how it looks
[12:05:08] <hazzy-lab> Loetmichel: You mean the have gotten more honest??
[12:05:09] <hazzy-lab> :)
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[12:05:28] <fragalot> 'sup
[12:05:36] <Loetmichel> hazzy-dev: no, the process is better, less faulty cores ;)
[12:06:09] <Loetmichel> doesent add any marging to sell partially defective if there are only few
[12:06:57] <hazzy-lab> Loetmichel: ah, that makes sense, no point in wasting parts if you can still uses the with fewer cores
[12:07:40] <Loetmichel> in the beginning of multicore CPUs one of the vendors did. either Intel or AMD
[12:08:06] <Loetmichel> they sold quadcore as dualcore with 2 cores disabled, when one or two of the cores were defective
[12:08:42] <Loetmichel> but that only makes sense if you have enough faulty chips to warrant a "product line" for them, with all the work attached
[12:09:10] <Loetmichel> if you only have very few bad chips its cheaper to just toss them
[12:10:12] <Loetmichel> but what i meant is that back in the days some "ingenious" people bought those CPUs and reenabled the cores and sold them as the expensive full working variant.
[12:10:17] <tjtr33> skunkworks, hello. fwiw gcode slicing can be done on linux with: gcode to camotics to stl to slic3r to gcode. This worked with 3D_chips.ngc.
[12:10:25] <Loetmichel> with the expected results of some of them not working correctly
[12:10:38] <Loetmichel> either instantly or when heated up
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[14:14:26] * jthornton just spent 1/2 hour at the social security office signing up to get an appointment next month to sign up for medicare
[14:15:08] <robotustra> jthornton, what country?
[14:22:46] <Rab> Sounds like USA!
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[14:32:41] <robotustra> in canada you shouldn't go anywhere to sign up for medicare
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[15:13:40] <jthornton> USA
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[15:16:06] <robotustra> such burocracy should be done automatically
[15:16:57] <robotustra> it's unacceptable in 21st century to spend the time for such bullshit
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[15:35:17] <enleth> Loetmichel: I'm pretty sure they still use that approach for different base frequency models
[15:36:31] <enleth> Loetmichel: as in, they only produce one "i3", "i5" and "i7", then test them to see what frequency they can handle without glitches and within the TDP
[15:37:48] <Tom_L> jthornton, that bad ehh?
[15:38:10] <Tom_L> take notes, i may need em
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[15:39:17] <JT-Shop> not bad at all and very informative
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[15:39:22] <JT-Shop> how old are you?
[15:39:54] <Tom_L> 21900 days and change
[15:40:06] <Tom_L> at least til sunday
[15:40:40] <JT-Shop> you got a ways to go lol
[15:40:55] <Tom_L> yeah, my sis just signed up
[15:41:20] <JT-Shop> for medicare?
[15:41:25] <Tom_L> ss
[15:41:35] <Tom_L> i dunno what she did about medicare
[15:42:11] <JT-Shop> 3 months before your 65th birthday you need to sign up for medicare
[15:42:25] <Tom_L> i gotta wait until 67
[15:42:45] <Tom_L> i think you can get mc at 65 though right?
[15:43:20] <Tom_L> i haven't honestly checked on it. just from what i've been hearing
[15:43:23] <JT-Shop> mc?
[15:43:28] <Tom_L> medicare
[15:43:52] <JT-Shop> yes mc at 65 and full ss at 66 for me
[15:44:14] <Tom_L> same for her, i gotta wait another year
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[16:03:40] <jdh> 67.5
[16:03:48] <jdh> lame
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[17:00:36] <JT-Shop> dang youngsters lol
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[17:06:44] <roycroft> i have a few years to go before i'm eligible for medicare
[17:06:48] <roycroft> i hope it's still around then
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[17:21:39] <jthornton> I hope I'm still around then
[17:24:26] <roycroft> i'm too stubborn to not be :)
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[17:39:01] <roycroft> i'm cheating a little bit today
[17:39:26] <roycroft> i'm not offically off work for another 20 minutes, but i've already forwarded mail for one of my accounts to vacation
[17:39:40] <roycroft> 'cuz i really don't want to deal with any last-minute emails to that account
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[18:00:08] <roycroft> i'm on vacation officially!
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[18:01:17] <Jin^eLD> hi, I am trying to run the example from http://linuxcnc.org which says:
[18:01:22] <Jin^eLD> halrun -I loadusr pyvcp -c mypanel tiny.xml
[18:01:27] <Jin^eLD> but that results in an error
[18:01:35] <Jin^eLD> halrun: too many arguments <loadusr pyvcp -c mypanel tiny.xml>
[18:01:39] <Jin^eLD> any ideas?
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[18:05:39] <SpeedEvil> Somewhat tangentially - can anyone think of vendors for gold dots? I want to solder them on in place of light gold plating to make something actually work well for a long time, rather than a short time. Something like 100um thick 0.5-1mm dots.
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[18:28:04] <hazzy-lab> Jin^eLD: I get have the same problem here ...
[18:28:14] <hazzy-lab> wonder if you found a bug
[18:28:34] <hazzy-lab> try first launching halcmd
[18:28:55] <hazzy-lab> and then running the pyvcp command
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[18:29:19] <hazzy-lab> $ halrun
[18:29:32] <hazzy-lab> halcmd: loadusr pyvcp -c mypanel tiny.xml
[18:29:39] <hazzy-lab> that worked for me
[18:30:31] <hazzy-lab> aha!
[18:30:41] <hazzy-lab> it should be:
[18:30:42] <hazzy-lab> halcmd loadusr pyvcp -c mypanel tiny.xml
[18:30:50] <hazzy-lab> that works
[18:30:57] <hazzy-lab> I will fix the docs
[18:31:03] <Jin^eLD> it seems to work from inside halcmd
[18:31:53] <hazzy-lab> try $ halcmd loadusr pyvcp -c mypanel tiny.xml
[18:31:56] <hazzy-lab> that works
[18:32:31] <Jin^eLD> thank you :)
[18:33:09] <hazzy-lab> thank you for reporting the error in the docs :)
[18:33:44] <Jin^eLD> well, at that point I was assuming I messed up somewhere ;)
[18:34:18] <infornography> tfw you want to work on cnc stuff but you have to go work on life stuff...
[18:34:26] <Jin^eLD> I get the impression people prefer glade? or is pyvcp widely used?
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[18:39:22] <hazzy-lab> Jin^eLD: Glade has its whole set of problems, I'd stick with pyvcp until something better comes along (thinking cmorley's QtVCP ...)
[18:42:37] <Jin^eLD> I think pyvcp is more than enough for my needs
[18:43:27] <Jin^eLD> I only need to simulate/test a HAL component so tht I dont destroy any hardware while developing it
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[19:06:28] <Jin^eLD> night
[19:06:42] Jin^eLD is now known as Jin|away
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[20:57:10] <ziper> anyone built a filament winder
[21:03:15] <hazzy-lab> ziper: Like this?
[21:03:16] <hazzy-lab> https://www.flickr.com
[21:04:07] <ziper> no, a single thread around a mandrel
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[21:04:34] <ziper> unless I am misunderstanding what i am looking at
[21:04:41] <ziper> that looks like one of those old wicker chairs
[21:05:03] <ziper> or maybe they were fiberglass?
[21:05:06] <hazzy-lab> there are more pics, use the side to side buttons to scroll thru them
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[21:06:16] <hazzy-lab> that is a filament winder was made at the linuxcnc stuttgart meet up a few weeks ago
[21:06:35] <hazzy-lab> you are thinking more of like a coil winder?
[21:07:22] <ziper> was the carbon tow strung up manually and then the two disks twisted?
[21:09:46] <ziper> like this, but long and skinny https://www.youtube.com
[21:10:12] <ziper> one concern I have is that to get strength in the length direction you would need to traverse it back and forth pretty fast
[21:10:21] <hazzy-lab> ziper: that is a good question, I was not there, but assume it was all done with linuxcnc (be kinda disappointing it not :) )
[21:10:26] <ziper> and I guess just cut off the ends where it doubles back?
[21:11:16] <hazzy-lab> ah, I see, so like for laying up a tube or tank
[21:11:52] <hazzy-lab> I guess you would have to cut the ends ..
[21:12:34] <hazzy-lab> you know, I have never paid enough attention to how that is usually done
[21:14:18] <hazzy-lab> my water filter tank for example is laid up as one piece, wonder how they get the core/form out ..
[21:14:56] <ziper> seems well suited for a pressure vessel
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[21:15:23] <ziper> maybe I should do the math and see if it is even actually any better than buying the cloth and laying it up by hand
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[21:18:27] <hazzy-lab> depending on what you need, the winder could be pretty crude, probably don;t even need CNC, just have a switch at the end of travel that reversed the traverse direction
[21:18:32] <hazzy-lab> what are you making?
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[21:25:18] <ziper> sailboat spars
[21:25:37] <ziper> a mast (6meters) as well as racks for sitting on (1 meter)
[21:25:55] <hazzy-lab> oh, sweet!
[21:26:29] <hazzy-lab> so you need good longitudinal strength ...
[21:29:11] <hazzy-lab> those are basically beams, so you really need the fibers running mostly length-wise, hmm
[21:29:25] <Tom_L> evening
[21:29:59] <hazzy-lab> Tom_L: evening
[21:30:38] <Tom_L> picked up a block of alum today to make my riser
[21:31:16] <Tom_L> 2.125 x 2.25 x longer
[21:31:44] <Tom_L> so i guess i'll raise it up 2.25"
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[21:32:24] <hazzy-lab> nice!
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[21:32:44] <Tom_L> only about 12 bux
[21:32:51] <hazzy-lab> 2.25" is a significant amount on that machine
[21:32:56] <Tom_L> yes
[21:32:57] <hazzy-lab> what is the total Z?
[21:33:02] <Tom_L> now?
[21:33:05] <hazzy-lab> yes
[21:33:31] <Tom_L> lemme see where i set the soft limits..
[21:33:49] <Tom_L> it's got quite a bit but i can't use it because it's all lower
[21:34:16] <hazzy-lab> ah, so now you will be able to make use of it better
[21:34:21] <hazzy-lab> great
[21:34:41] <Tom_L> 7"
[21:35:04] <Tom_L> but i can't use near that much with the vise
[21:35:08] <ziper> a spool of tow is a lot cheaper, only 1.5 dollars per ounce, instead of 4 for unidirectional and 7.5 for biax sleeve
[21:35:09] <hazzy-lab> ok, you can do a lot with that
[21:35:15] <Tom_L> yes
[21:35:44] <Tom_L> X is 17.75 Y is 13 and Z is 7
[21:36:00] <Tom_L> nice workspace for a small mill
[21:36:08] <hazzy-lab> indeed!
[21:36:17] <roycroft> that's a lot of y
[21:36:34] <Tom_L> yeah but it's not all useable because the table isn't that big
[21:36:45] <hazzy-lab> more than my full size bridge port on Y :)
[21:36:47] <Tom_L> but if i had a big part i could bolt it down and use it
[21:37:06] <Tom_L> the table's only something like 9" wide
[21:37:10] <roycroft> there's no law that says your part cannot overhang the table :)
[21:37:13] <Tom_L> i forget exactly
[21:37:19] <Tom_L> true
[21:38:00] <Tom_L> i may try some 2" square tube as a riser first and see how it acts
[21:38:08] <Tom_L> before i cut up the alum
[21:38:34] <Tom_L> they had a near perfect piece when i went by there today
[21:38:43] <Tom_L> just need to cut it in half and clean it up a bit
[21:41:37] <Tom_L> now i need to get another vise
[21:42:00] <Tom_L> could have used it on that last part i made
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[22:37:36] <flyback> https://www.youtube.com
[22:37:44] <flyback> magnus effect owns your "canuck"
[22:37:49] * flyback dropkicks Tom_L
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