#linuxcnc | Logs for 2018-08-17
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[01:17:40] <fragalot> hi
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[02:10:07] <jesseg> Howdy
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[03:01:50] <Deejay> moin
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[04:04:15] <fragalot> hey
[04:06:42] <Deejay> yup
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[04:56:58] <TurBoss> sup
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[05:29:59] <miss0r> hello
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[05:38:14] <fragalot> hi
[05:43:49] <miss0r> Arent you supposed to work? :D
[05:44:07] <miss0r> I mean, my boss would kill me if he found out I was slacking while having lunch :D
[05:44:23] <fragalot> I am :) and I already found & solved that 4ns jitter issue I had yesterday :P
[05:44:29] <TurBoss> I do while working :P
[05:44:55] <fragalot> IRC is mainly used for rubbber ducking. Which is a valid programming methodology
[05:47:07] <TurBoss> https://matrix.org
[05:52:23] <jthornton> morning
[05:52:40] <TurBoss> hello!
[06:07:41] <Tom_L> morning
[06:30:01] <XXCoder> yo
[06:30:36] <XXCoder> fragalot: is it anything like rubber hose decryption key recovery method?
[06:31:30] <fragalot> hehe
[06:31:32] <fragalot> bbl
[06:36:50] <miss0r> log
[06:36:50] <c-log> miss0r: Today's Log http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81
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[08:40:56] <{HD}> All right, who knows about manipulating STL files? I need to make this one bin deeper. Is there a push pull option or do I cut it and copy it and stack it?
[08:47:03] <fragalot> you might be able to use meshmixer to modify it
[08:47:20] <fragalot> don't have it installed here so can't see for myself
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[08:51:48] <{HD}> Eww an autodesk app. I’d rather struggle and waste my time with some foss app then use Autodesk.
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[08:53:08] <robotustra> if the stl file is text you can modify it manually
[08:53:36] <robotustra> as soon as you need to modify 1 coordinate only in a number of points
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[08:55:33] <robotustra> if you know your part and know the depth of the bin, just open it in a your best text editor, find the right number, make sure it's the 3rd coordinate (z axis)
[08:55:43] <robotustra> and modify it
[08:56:04] <robotustra> and do it for a number of points
[08:56:08] <{HD}> robotustra: that is an intriguing idea. I think I’ll actually give it a shot.
[08:56:22] <{HD}> If I knew the current height in Z couldn’t I just find and replace everything with that height to my new height?
[08:56:30] <robotustra> yes you can
[08:57:08] <robotustra> but make sure you modify the right axis
[08:57:18] <{HD}> Since it’s just a straight walled bin essentially I’m not too concerned with how the triangles turn out.
[08:57:30] <robotustra> yes
[08:57:43] <robotustra> and triangles will be quite fine
[08:57:52] <robotustra> so you should not care much
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[10:00:27] * Loetmichel just tested CamBam instead of BoCNC... foirst part has 2000++ hexagonal 4mm holes for air flow... MAAAN is that faster to work with AND faster to mill... the mill is milling away and shuddering on its (a bit weak) table like it wants to fall apart... no wonder though when you do 4mm hexagonal helixes with 1200mm/min :-)
[10:20:44] <Loetmichel> https://youtu.be <- *wobble*
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[11:59:20] <fragalot> 'sup
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[12:05:00] <Loetmichel> fragalot: had a revelation today... that my used "postprocessor" is utterly crap.
[12:05:11] <Loetmichel> i use Cambam now... MUUUCH better
[12:05:50] <gregcnc> post or cam?
[12:06:13] <Loetmichel> gregcnc: define...
[12:06:31] <Loetmichel> i use it to generate gcode from 2d DXF files
[12:06:38] <gregcnc> CAM generates the paths post translates to gcode
[12:06:42] <fragalot> Loetmichel: what did you use before?
[12:06:44] <Loetmichel> ist that cam or is that still postprocessor?
[12:06:48] <Loetmichel> BoCNC
[12:07:22] <fragalot> Loetmichel: CAM is what decides where the machine needs to go, post is what translates it to the correct gcodes for that particular machine
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[12:08:09] <Loetmichel> fragalot: so its more like a cam. although its just moving the lines according to mill bit radius
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[12:08:44] <fragalot> Loetmichel: typically the "post" part is part of the cam package :)
[12:08:49] <gregcnc> That is what cam does
[12:08:51] <fragalot> it's the part where you click "create gcode"
[12:09:06] <Loetmichel> yes
[12:10:21] <Loetmichel> gregcnc: i mean its not like "take a .stl, take a block of aluminium of THAT size and now mill it on all sides until the stl appears in the metal"
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[12:10:33] <gregcnc> 2D CAM
[12:10:53] <Loetmichel> its just mill bit radius correction and a bit of repeat in depth to not overload the mill bit
[12:11:05] <Loetmichel> yes, 2,5d cam, that fits ;)
[12:11:05] <fragalot> Loetmichel: still CAM :D
[12:11:14] <gregcnc> sure, but it's not a post processor
[12:11:22] <Loetmichel> part of it is ;)
[12:11:28] <fragalot> gregcnc: these days they're the same tool
[12:11:40] <gregcnc> callit whatever you like if you want ot be vague or incorrect
[12:11:56] <Loetmichel> i already agreed with you that its more cam
[12:11:59] <gregcnc> im out
[12:12:03] <Loetmichel> and that the PP is integrated
[12:12:40] <fragalot> :P
[12:12:43] <Loetmichel> maan, butthurt SO fast? how did you survive all those years on the internet?
[12:12:57] <fragalot> technically (in)correct, the best kind of (in)correct
[12:13:03] <gregcnc> i just have other shit to do
[12:13:55] <gregcnc> because bad posts exist as well as shitty CAM
[12:14:22] <fragalot> like what you said just now
[12:14:26] <fragalot> that's a bad post. :)
[12:14:48] <Loetmichel> point was that the "cam" i used before (freeware tool written by some old german guy back 10 or more years and not supported since then) is a PITA
[12:15:40] <fragalot> what a surprise :D
[12:16:03] <Loetmichel> it cant solve the "traveling salesman problem" so it forces you to click on each vector in the dxf to determine in which order it should mill it... VERY annoying if you have 2000++ little hexagons to mill for an air vent...
[12:16:17] <fragalot> hahaa :D
[12:16:47] <gregcnc> would your employer have to shut the doors if he had to pay for software?
[12:17:02] <Loetmichel> sometimes i have that feeling, yes...
[12:17:21] <Loetmichel> at least he has the pained expression every time he has to pay something
[12:18:07] <Loetmichel> its not like cambam would be expensive... took me 3 hours this morning to learn to use it... less than i would have sat there clicking on the vectors ;)
[12:18:19] <fragalot> ask him if it's OK if it costs €200 once if it saves you an hour a day.
[12:18:45] <Loetmichel> fragalot: it only costs 108 eur ;)
[12:19:21] <fragalot> same question
[12:20:46] <Loetmichel> he (surprisingly) already ordered it. after seeing how fast it is compared to the freeware tool... but the 1000 times i mention that i need a bit of modern software for the machine it was all "NOPE; NO MONEY SPARE FOR THAT!!!!111" if you know what i mean,
[12:21:03] <gregcnc> pfft what could the employer do with 250hr/yr
[12:22:09] <Loetmichel> gregcnc: i tried multiple times to talk sense into him with that argument... only now that i used the demo to show him he changed course...
[12:22:29] <gregcnc> good now take him to see a Datron
[12:22:41] <Loetmichel> i have to admit that i thought Cambam would be about a 1000, not a 100 eur
[12:23:00] <gregcnc> And also proper riveting and deburring tooling
[12:23:28] <Loetmichel> riveting? we have all the riveting tooling we need for the few rivets we use
[12:30:58] <fragalot> still - show him a datron :D
[12:31:05] <fragalot> 'look. same parts, 10% of the time'
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[12:40:10] <Loetmichel> fragalot1: i dont think so. for one: we have no room for a datron
[12:40:41] <Loetmichel> for two: for that price tag we would rather place 20 cnc6040 in a rack on the wall and use them in parallel.
[12:40:52] <Loetmichel> still cheaper and a lot more output ;)
[12:41:29] <Loetmichel> but usually i only make prototypes. series is done by sheet metal companies
[12:41:41] <Loetmichel> lately more often than not in china :-(
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[12:55:58] <fragalot> seems I got banned for having a bad internet connection, lol
[12:56:24] <fragalot> oh wait it's because my client used an unregistered nickname
[12:59:36] <fragalot> miss0r: chronos is having a sale on machine vises. :D
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[13:22:40] <fragalot> what the hell is going on with my internet connection >.<
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[13:24:16] <fragalot> when in doubt, reboot everything.
[13:25:32] <miss0r> fragalot. Nice! how did you know I was having a machine vise shortage here? :D
[13:26:52] <fragalot> miss0r: I just know things, y'know?
[13:27:05] <miss0r> apparently
[13:30:22] <miss0r> JT-Shop you around?
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[13:54:03] <fragalot> miss0r: any news re those tapping heads? :P
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[14:09:29] <miss0r> fragalot: Yep.
[14:09:35] <miss0r> I have them both in the back of my car
[14:09:47] <fragalot> they're no good there
[14:09:54] <miss0r> Got the two of them for 134eur
[14:10:05] <fragalot> ... do they work?
[14:10:06] <fragalot> :P
[14:10:25] <miss0r> I have only tested them in my hands, so I don't know :) but for that price it hardly matters :)
[14:10:33] <fragalot> I think it matters
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[14:10:51] <fragalot> otherwise I have a lot of things that you could have for a low price
[14:10:54] <fragalot> :D
[14:10:58] <miss0r> not to me :) I'm going to put them up on one of those hunters ornemantal wooden showoff platters
[14:11:08] <fragalot> haha
[14:11:13] <miss0r> and hang it on the wall :P
[14:11:29] <miss0r> I have another operation to run on the cnc, then I will go get'em
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[14:30:46] <fragalot> miss0r: you know that "pretty" DRO I found? turns out their website is awful and won't let me add things to the cart. lol
[14:31:19] <miss0r> well.. that pretty much makes up your mind, now don'it?
[14:31:47] <fragalot> yea.. I tried adding it by hand but it seems that it's their API that's broken
[14:34:49] <CaptHindsight> yallr soundin more and more like uhmericans every day!
[14:36:50] <miss0r> I'm not sure how to respond to that. Have our vocabulary degraded to a point we are indistinguishable from the 'uhmericans' ? :D
[14:36:59] <fragalot> uhm
[14:37:10] <miss0r> it ment to say 'where we' :/
[14:37:30] <fragalot> like a true american you fucked up completely :D
[14:37:41] <miss0r> yeah. I know.
[14:37:50] <miss0r> Did I mention; I hate filing?!
[14:38:45] <miss0r> I had plenty for a lifetime back in machine school(all tradesmen, even carpenters ect. have to go to that class before starting on the education that they actualy wanted to begin with)
[14:39:14] <fragalot> same, lol
[14:39:20] <CaptHindsight> don'it was likely a typo, but it brought me some joy
[14:39:20] <miss0r> they gave you a sawn rawstock. and you had to file it square & parallel to a specific size +/- 0.05mm
[14:39:31] <fragalot> "here's a rough sawn cube. now go square it up, here's your worn out file"
[14:39:38] <miss0r> CaptHindsight: No typo actualy :)
[14:40:15] <miss0r> fragalot: Something like that. Well - Back then I had plenty to last me a lifetime. So doing filing now (not including deburring) just kills me
[14:41:10] <miss0r> CaptHindsight: Basically I think I've been watching too much abom79 lately. That southern drawl is catchy :]
[14:42:32] <fragalot> ah-ha! that same DRO is available, from the same company, through amazon
[14:43:07] <miss0r> no wonder they don't want to bother keeping their own API afloat, when they probally only sell stuff through amazon.
[14:43:10] <CaptHindsight> https://youtu.be this show was on for pert near 30 years
[14:43:12] <miss0r> well, at the moment that is a given :D
[14:43:43] <fragalot> miss0r: >.> "this seller does not deliver to belgium"
[14:43:59] <miss0r> >.<
[14:44:27] <miss0r> Try Denmark... I won't help you out or anything, I just want to laugh if they deliever here :D
[14:44:44] <fragalot> damnit all I want is a nice retro (reliable) 3-axis DRO with 0.001mm magnetic scales
[14:44:58] <fragalot> why 0.001 and not 0.005? because I hate myself. that's why. :D
[14:45:23] <fragalot> local guy sells 'm, but it's €500 per axis,... which I'm not OK with.
[14:45:24] <miss0r> that must be it
[14:45:36] <fragalot> (and that's for a 150mm travel)
[14:45:39] <miss0r> go contact that company I linked you to
[14:45:45] <fragalot> will do
[14:45:54] <miss0r> Thats the real stuff
[14:45:55] <Simonious> what is going on in Solidworks when it shows a single sketch that I am not currently editing? I've rebuilt.. closed and reloaded.. and yet this perplexing state remains, all of my operations still show in the tree and when I highlight them I can see they are still there, but the model is not showing..
[14:46:01] <SpeedEvil> fine-tipped pen, straight-edge, USB microscope.
[14:46:20] <miss0r> SpeedEvil: :D
[14:46:25] <miss0r> don't tempt him
[14:46:34] <Simonious> hmm, got it back.. highlighted one extrude and selected how
[14:46:37] <Simonious> *show
[14:46:41] <Simonious> I messed have keymashed something odd
[14:47:02] <miss0r> Simonious: I was going to suggest CRT burnin :P
[14:47:24] <Simonious> lol..
[14:47:30] <Simonious> that must be it!
[14:47:50] <miss0r> :]
[14:48:38] <Tom_L> lively bunch of crackpots here today
[14:48:46] <miss0r> DAMN IT ! This fridge as got to go or something! I just wanted a nice cold coke, but now I have to wait for it to thaw. Its solid
[14:49:01] <Tom_L> heat it up
[14:49:07] <Tom_L> put it in the microwave
[14:49:11] <miss0r> :D
[14:49:28] <miss0r> I think its a good thing for my personal safety that I do not keep a microwave in here
[14:49:33] <Tom_L> lemme know how that goes for ya
[14:50:12] <miss0r> ha! I have a din-rail mount thermostat rated for 16amps on the contacts. I will do some mods to that fridge :)
[14:50:13] <Tom_L> put some Ti shavings in there with it
[14:50:43] <miss0r> Yeah, I don't have that laying around. Only ever did two project with it
[14:51:10] <Tom_L> i've got a small sheet of some but i rarely ever use i
[14:51:17] <Tom_L> t
[14:51:28] <miss0r> but I *DO* have a 80mm long ø40 PEEK rod on the shelf... Its my retirement fond right there
[14:51:32] <Tom_L> damn i need a new keyboard
[14:54:01] <fragalot> miss0r: that danish guy STILL hasn't replied, and i've sent that email at least 20 seconds ago
[14:54:05] <fragalot> damn lazy danes
[14:54:34] <Tom_L> 20 sec!!!
[14:54:37] <miss0r> knowing them, it would not surprise me they actualy answered now :D
[14:54:45] * fragalot just got an email
[14:54:48] <Tom_L> and you expect a reply that quick??
[14:55:02] <fragalot> meh, spam from the gun club
[14:55:11] <miss0r> hehe :D
[14:55:12] <fragalot> one of those "FW: FWD: RE: FWD: FW:.."
[14:55:12] <Tom_L> and you were all excited
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[14:56:01] <miss0r> fragalot: To quite a cartoon I like(family guy): "Your anguish sustains me"
[14:56:19] <fragalot> i'm not allowed to wtch that anymore.. wifey says no.
[14:56:37] <fragalot> apparently it is "so bad"
[14:56:59] <CaptHindsight> Seth MacFarlane show
[14:57:45] <miss0r> fragalot: Have you ever seen bricklebarry ? (if not, DO! but keep it secret from the wifey)
[14:57:59] <CaptHindsight> stream it at work :)
[14:58:43] <miss0r> its like the offspring of family guy being raped by south park.. and then said offspring started taking steroids and heroin
[14:58:47] <miss0r> something like that :P
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[14:59:01] <miss0r> CaptHindsight: You found amusing? :D
[14:59:34] <fragalot> miss0r: I haven't.. but she enjoys things like JoJo's bizarre Adventure..
[14:59:35] <fragalot> go figure
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[15:00:13] <miss0r> fragalot: https://www.youtube.com
[15:02:12] <CaptHindsight> I often find that I have to use a southern drawl or voice from South Park to get the message across to locals
[15:03:52] <fragalot> haha
[15:04:32] <miss0r> fragalot: if you are not convinced yet: https://www.youtube.com 2:22 minuts of top 10 stuff from season 3
[15:05:38] <fragalot> maybe some other time
[15:06:48] <miss0r> *You must see it all*
[15:07:31] <CaptHindsight> gross out humor
[15:08:15] <miss0r> I love it
[15:08:28] <miss0r> fragalot: You dropped the binkey bomb on me, This is me trying to return a favour
[15:09:56] <SpeedEvil> Also - yay - new ZeFrank.
[15:10:31] <fragalot> miss0r: 'snotworking :D
[15:10:54] <miss0r> >.< !
[15:11:48] <CaptHindsight> no it'snot
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[15:31:26] <miss0r> That feeling of regret, when you mount the first workpeice in the mill, after you did a proper cleaning of it
[15:31:57] <XXCoder> would be nice if there was self cleaning mode
[15:31:59] <XXCoder> like oven
[15:32:31] <fragalot> miss0r: do you have T-slot covers yet?
[15:33:01] * SpeedEvil tries to remember who did a nice 'here is how to make guards for your machine tool using neoprene covered kevlar' or something.
[15:33:50] <SpeedEvil> https://www.youtube.com ah
[15:34:24] <miss0r> bah... No covers here :D
[15:36:22] <fragalot> miss0r: make/get some. They are WorthIt (tm)
[15:36:36] <fragalot> in my case it was just wooden boards that were match-fit to the sides of the vise :P
[15:37:24] <XXCoder> lol surpising little can cover pretty good. one machine broke its ballscrew covers, and maintance guy just put wood "fence" at that end of table since we couldnt stop running the hot job
[15:37:25] <SpeedEvil> The above may be going too far. :)
[15:37:28] <SpeedEvil> But is awesome
[15:37:45] <XXCoder> but that little wood fence blocked over 90% of chips going there
[15:37:57] <miss0r> bah. I don't want to cover up all that shiny cast iron
[15:38:04] <XXCoder> once job was done machine was down for maintance
[15:38:40] <miss0r> I use the t-slots waay too much, even while the vise is in there
[15:40:15] <fragalot> miss0r: enjoy cleanup then
[15:40:49] <miss0r> Oh I will! (not)
[15:41:52] <miss0r> I will do it, but refuse to enjoy it
[15:42:38] <SpeedEvil> Pressure washer hooked to coolant.
[15:42:52] <fragalot> makes for a great through-spindle coolant setup, SpeedEvil
[15:43:01] <fragalot> assuming you have short cycles :P
[15:43:03] <SpeedEvil> :)
[15:43:19] <SpeedEvil> Add a booster to 60000PSI and you don't even need a tool.
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[15:44:25] <fragalot> not sure I'd want to put that through the spindle, loll
[15:47:10] <XXCoder> mill/water jet cutter combo machine!
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[15:50:15] <CaptHindsight> just put a bunch of pressure washer nozzles around the machine, blast at the end of each job
[15:50:55] <XXCoder> mill & wash cycle machine eh
[15:51:03] <XXCoder> how about adding spin dry mode also
[15:52:12] <fragalot> you can get fans to put in your toolchanger
[15:52:21] <fragalot> i've always wondered if those work at all
[15:52:37] <XXCoder> dunno though I also wonder if machine could do deburr also
[15:52:46] <XXCoder> using brillo on tool head or something
[15:52:54] <fragalot> of course it could
[15:53:54] <CaptHindsight> http://img.directindustry.com
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[15:54:14] <XXCoder> lol
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[15:54:32] <robotustra> {HD}, how is the result of STL modifying?
[15:55:43] <{HD}> I cheated and imported them into sketchup and then used the push-pull tool.
[15:56:28] <fragalot> I had no idea sketchup supported importing & modifying STL's
[15:56:43] <Simonious> fragalot: I use that feature quite a lot
[15:57:09] <fragalot> I remember trying to export to STL like 4 years ago & gave up in frustration and never looked back
[15:57:21] <Simonious> fragalot: openSCAD is also an option
[15:57:55] <Simonious> fragalot: I think solidworks can do it, but honestly if I'm going to do it in solidworks, I open it in sketchup, which is quite a lot easier to measure an STL in and then regenerate the whole thing in Solidworks..
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[15:58:32] <Simonious> fragalot: I was exporting STLs 5 and 6 years ago with sketchup using add ons.
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[15:59:52] <fragalot> Simonious: I'm an autodesk guy thanks to work
[15:59:56] <fragalot> seems to work for me
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[16:00:24] <fragalot> i've used openscad for a while too, works well if you don't want to make anything organic
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[16:07:30] <miss0r> "stupid program can't even whip up a fried egg"
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[16:17:40] <Simonious> fragalot: closest I get to autodesk is Fusion360, which I use almost exclusively for CAM (and poorly at that), I need to improve my 'preamble' and 'postamble', or whatever you call those - all I need is it to lift BEFORE the initial rapid and I also want it to lift at the end of a cut - I'm hand setting Z and I want to be able to leave it at that height and hit go and NOT have it drag through the work.
[16:17:56] <robotustra> {HD}, anyway, task is completed
[16:18:06] <Simonious> fragalot: for organic shapes I've had success with MOI, however I've let those stills atrophie and die.
[16:18:19] <fragalot> Simonious: I've not had much luck with f360 personally
[16:18:20] <Simonious> *atrophy?
[16:18:27] <fragalot> coming from the inventor suite, it feels atrocious
[16:18:28] <Simonious> fragalot: yeah, limited here too.
[16:18:45] <fragalot> they took a good thing, and stripped away everything useful
[16:19:21] <Simonious> yeah well.. then they gave it away, so..
[16:19:58] <fragalot> There's just a few things I wish they kept
[16:20:12] <fragalot> one of which is the feature browser rather than that damn inline history thing they use now
[16:20:59] <Simonious> I never got into autocad, how do you like it?
[16:21:35] <fragalot> it's good, but christ is it expensive (just like any pro CAD package)
[16:22:12] <Simonious> yeah.. my seat for solidworks is the cheap seat.. I think it was over 1k and less than 2k.. haven't renewed since 2016, so..
[16:22:39] <fragalot> there seem to be 3 main camps in the CAD world.. autodesk, solidworks, or whatever FOSS project
[16:22:45] <fragalot> Simonious: good news, yuo can no longer get those
[16:22:49] <fragalot> subscription only from now on
[16:22:55] <Simonious> heh.. ugh
[16:23:10] <Simonious> what about ProE? or whatever, isn't that a thing?
[16:23:12] <fragalot> same story with autodesk, adobe, etc..
[16:23:17] <fragalot> proe?
[16:23:28] * Simonious shrugs
[16:23:52] <XXCoder> pro-rated on E? :P
[16:24:13] <jdh> pro-e, catia, other pricey ones
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[16:30:00] <fragalot> never heard of those, so no comment
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[16:30:14] <fragalot> i'm in my own little bubble :P
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[16:30:30] <Simonious> Hope you shower often.
[16:31:32] <XXCoder> bubble has rainse and spin dry mode?
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[16:31:59] <fragalot> XXCoder: I just flip it inside out every now and again
[16:32:16] <XXCoder> lol
[16:36:03] <Roguish> lots of commercial CAD / Modelling programs.
[16:36:34] <XXCoder> 99.99999999% is windows only
[16:36:35] <Roguish> most all $$$$$ for small businesses.
[16:36:47] <Roguish> XXCoder: that's true.
[16:37:13] <Roguish> it's a corporate thing.
[16:37:59] <fragalot> 't is
[16:38:34] <Roguish> and worse, they're all most all going to 'subscription' payments. instead of getting bent over once, you get bent over monthly..... oh joy.
[16:39:09] <Simonious> Roguish: yeah.. the only reason my desktop is windows is for CAD
[16:39:17] <fragalot> Roguish: no you don't
[16:39:21] <fragalot> you can also bend over yearly
[16:39:22] <Simonious> Roguish: I do all my developing on a linux VM which is NOT hosted on my desktop.
[16:39:30] <fragalot> they give you options.
[16:39:31] <fragalot> :P
[16:39:55] <fragalot> my MAIN problem with subscription model software for CORPORATE use, is that if that company ever goes tits up.. your data is gone.
[16:39:56] <XXCoder> freecad cam is slowly developing
[16:40:00] <fragalot> you can no longer access your design files
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[16:40:04] <Roguish> ooooooo. that feels good. please sir, can I have some more?
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[16:40:26] <fragalot> need that design you made 10yrs ago because the customer ordered the exact same thing agian?
[16:40:30] <fragalot> tough.
[16:40:51] <CaptHindsight> where we pass the screwings on to you!
[16:41:01] <Simonious> open source isn't there yet, but just maybe they'll plug that hole in a satisfactory way at some point.
[16:41:07] <fragalot> heck, we're still usnig embedded compilers that were discontinued 17 years ago
[16:41:08] <Roguish> I hate 'the cloud' I want my data in my little hands.
[16:41:20] <Simonious> openSCAD is a viable solution, not as easy to use a the pay stuff, but powerful.
[16:41:33] <Deejay> gn8
[16:41:47] <fragalot> Simonious: it is not a viable alternative to a proper CAD package though
[16:41:55] <fragalot> it's good for 3D modelling, but that's it
[16:41:55] <CaptHindsight> they tried the "cloud" in the late 90's but the cable and internet providers did not cooperate
[16:41:57] <XXCoder> no CAM in openscad
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[16:42:34] <Simonious> XXCoder: totally true.. and F360 isn't awesome, there is a freeCAM out there, I've tried it.. not great, but if you REALLY want to stay free, it can be done.
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[16:43:07] <CaptHindsight> part of the problem is if you have to work with a large co that uses NX, Catia etc, then you need it as well
[16:43:08] <XXCoder> freecam isnt safe term to search at work
[16:43:09] <Roguish> if you think CAD is expensive, try pricing high end analysis programs. mega dollars.
[16:43:17] <fragalot> XXCoder: lol
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[16:43:32] <CaptHindsight> Roguish: that only sort of works
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[16:43:36] <XXCoder> Simonious: dude they need to change name.
[16:43:47] <XXCoder> I filtered out adult stuff and I get webcams and security cams
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[16:44:08] <CaptHindsight> openSCAM ? :)
[16:44:16] <XXCoder> no freecam
[16:44:25] <XXCoder> tried to research it but cant find
[16:44:29] <fragalot> Roguish: yup. we pay mega dollars for our CFD analysis tools.. (no idea what they use, but ooh boy pricey)
[16:45:16] <CaptHindsight> Ansys ain't cheap either
[16:45:21] <Roguish> basic Solidworks is like 3k. add their top analysis and it's over 30k.
[16:45:45] <Roguish> same with Pro-E, now called Creo.
[16:45:49] <fragalot> Roguish: can you still get the perpetual licenses?
[16:45:53] <Roguish> yeah, then there
[16:46:05] <XXCoder> Simonious: wheres freecam site?
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[16:46:33] <Simonious> XXCoder: err FREE CAD?
[16:46:35] <Roguish> fragalot: some still offer prepetual, but maybe not for much longer.
[16:46:48] <XXCoder> no wonder I couldnt find it lol
[16:47:42] <Roguish> fragalot: I just found a pretty good FEA multiphysics program called ELMER. open source too.
[16:47:51] <CaptHindsight> https://www.freecadweb.org
[16:48:09] <CaptHindsight> https://www.cnccookbook.com
[16:48:12] <Roguish> https://www.csc.fi
[16:48:13] <XXCoder> CaptHindsight: yes, I know where freecad site is. :P
[16:48:29] <Roguish> https://sourceforge.net
[16:49:16] <XXCoder> Roguish: https://www.freecadweb.org
[16:50:04] <Simonious> https://www.google.com
[16:51:00] * fragalot is wondering if it would be useful to buy an engine hoist this weekend before his schaublin shows up
[16:51:13] <fragalot> I think not.. probably too wide
[16:51:16] <jdh> buy.
[16:51:30] <fragalot> yeah, just looked up the specs, it's 90cm wide, and I only have 80
[16:51:35] <CaptHindsight> fragalot: won't help down the basement stairs
[16:51:52] <fragalot> CaptHindsight: hehe - thankfully there's only a single step it needs to get up.. and a slope
[16:51:59] <fragalot> and a narrow passage
[16:52:01] <Simonious> http://www.craftsmanspace.com CAM BAM is the one I was thinking of for free CAM, it works, but.. last time I tried it, it wasn't awesome.
[16:52:03] <fragalot> and gravel
[16:52:10] <fragalot> but otherwise it's a clear path!
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[16:53:44] <XXCoder> cam bam ehh
[16:54:04] <CaptHindsight> fragalot: I'd be happy to loan you my forklift
[16:54:06] <Simonious> tried it?
[16:54:13] <XXCoder> yeah
[16:54:21] <XXCoder> need to check it out again been a bit
[16:54:21] <fragalot> CaptHindsight: can it fit through a 6 meter long 80cm wide alley?
[16:54:31] <XXCoder> is heekcam still riciously crashy?
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[16:54:52] <CaptHindsight> fragalot: no but it can make it wider :p
[16:55:30] <fragalot> I'm thinking of putting the schaublin onto a custom width pallet, and rolling it on pipes shimmying it forward with a large crowbar
[16:55:34] <fragalot> until I hit the step
[16:55:50] <fragalot> after that I'm going to need to have a good long think about why I bought this thing
[16:55:59] * Simonious chuckles
[16:56:08] <Simonious> bench mount? freestanding?
[16:56:24] <fragalot> Simonious: schaublin 13, freestanding small tool room mill
[16:56:30] <fragalot> it's only 800kg
[16:56:39] <fragalot> which is really light in machine terms, but still too heavy to lift :D
[16:56:40] <Simonious> deadly
[16:57:03] <Simonious> huh.. and I have a piano in my garage I don't want to deal with..
[16:57:21] <Simonious> that machine is on another level in weight.
[16:57:22] <XXCoder> surpised anyonme have one now
[16:57:25] <CaptHindsight> fragalot: I used skates and a mop and soap
[16:57:39] <fragalot> CaptHindsight: how does the soap help?
[16:57:47] <fragalot> helps wiht misalignment?
[16:57:57] <Simonious> fragalot: when it falls on you, you have a chance of slipping out of the way instead of squishing.
[16:58:16] <fragalot> Simonious: it's a very low center of gravity machine with a relatively wide base
[16:58:20] <fragalot> the chance of it tipping over is slim
[16:58:31] <Simonious> not as slim as you'll be if it does
[16:58:34] <fragalot> haha
[16:58:35] <CaptHindsight> fragalot: the floors are sealed and slick, the soap helps me slide it
[16:59:12] <CaptHindsight> convert your gravel to sealed concrete
[16:59:26] <fragalot> CaptHindsight: my floor is a mixture of loose fine gravel & sand, followed by a 6 meter section of belgian blue, followed by uneven concrete with cat prints in it
[16:59:33] <fragalot> it's not my gravel
[16:59:37] <fragalot> it's the city's
[16:59:46] <fragalot> and they like to roto-till it at random times
[16:59:55] <CaptHindsight> donate improvements
[17:00:01] <CaptHindsight> oh wonderful
[17:00:15] <fragalot> so there is a chance they COULD be doing that just before the truck arrives :D
[17:00:28] <CaptHindsight> do they spray water on it during cold spells?
[17:00:29] <fragalot> (not that the truck can fit that path)
[17:00:40] <fragalot> they do not water it
[17:01:18] <CaptHindsight> wooden ramp and pig fat
[17:01:20] <fragalot> so after it's all dug up the wind carries it all over the place, and the rain helps compact the deep ruts caused by someone driving over it
[17:01:33] <fragalot> :D
[17:03:38] <CaptHindsight> I was looking at a shop with a gantry crane ~10 tons
[17:04:04] <fragalot> I couldn't install a gantry even if I wanted to for several reasons
[17:04:07] <CaptHindsight> went from the truck bay to 1/2 way into the shop space
[17:04:23] <CaptHindsight> would be handy for machines on/off flatbeds
[17:04:28] <fragalot> a) no space, b) no structural integrity, c) both ceiling and wall space is completely occupied :P
[17:04:33] <fragalot> CaptHindsight: that's nice
[17:04:55] <CaptHindsight> but only a steel vs concrete building :(
[17:05:05] * Simonious goes to inspect the gantry crane
[17:05:17] <Simonious> the two arm cranes are 1 tons ea I think
[17:05:46] <fragalot> I'm off - ttyl :)
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[17:07:20] <Simonious> heh, the gantry is little, 550#s
[17:09:41] <CaptHindsight> enough for most engines
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[17:10:47] <CaptHindsight> I was at a guys house with a built in garage. He built a ceiling track to move engines around
[17:10:53] <Simonious> eh.. kindof hard to get a vehicle to, one of the guys has diy engine hoist he'll bring in for the asking, it's been here before when he was making some upgrades to it.
[17:11:00] <Simonious> CaptHindsight: nice
[17:11:07] <CaptHindsight> I-beams tied to the ceiling joists
[17:11:14] <CaptHindsight> but he curved them
[17:12:04] <CaptHindsight> went in a rectangle around the garage
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[17:29:11] <Loetmichel> Simonious: since engine hoists cost less than 100 eur on ebay: why do someone buld that himself?
[17:29:26] <Loetmichel> does build
[17:29:52] <Simonious> Loetmichel: honestly it might be older than ebay, it's certainly burlier than the average hoist.
[17:30:02] <Loetmichel> ok then ;)
[17:30:49] <Simonious> IIRC, it's 2x4" tube stock all the way around and uses an oversized bottle jack to perform the lifting.
[17:30:56] <Loetmichel> <- just bought one when the need arose to get a new engine for the BMW... looks a bit lost in the trunk of the Omega though ;) ->http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=16652&g2_imageViewsIndex=1
[17:31:04] <Simonious> tube.. more like square stock I guess
[17:31:23] <CaptHindsight> https://www.farmandfleet.com $180
[17:31:44] <CaptHindsight> there is no way I would want to build this vs buy it
[17:31:57] <Loetmichel> that looks exaclty like mine
[17:32:14] <Simonious> That looks a lot lighter than the beast this guy has, and it has a lot less reach.
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[17:32:38] <Simonious> probably works nicer than the homebrew unit though. *shrugs*
[17:33:15] <Loetmichel> CaptHindsight: only that i paid 99 eur for it ;)
[17:33:15] <CaptHindsight> still takes 30 min to assemble
[17:33:45] <Loetmichel> including shipping ;)
[17:34:07] <CaptHindsight> 4 fasteners for each caster, that almost line up
[17:34:25] <Loetmichel> CaptHindsight: did you peek when i assembled mine?
[17:34:48] <Loetmichel> you would have gotten red ears cause of my cussing ;.)
[17:35:44] <CaptHindsight> i went through checking 4 boxes of parts at HF for a 20 ton press
[17:35:58] <CaptHindsight> I was looking at the welds....
[17:36:46] <CaptHindsight> when i finally found a good one and got it home the return springs did not fit since they had good welds but not properly spaced :(
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[18:15:40] <CaptHindsight> some things I just buy and then expect to have to fiddle with to make it work well
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[22:23:44] <{HD}> Sketchup 2018 has import export stl built in. Used to be a plugin...
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[23:58:46] <Crom> 9pm still 75 degrees f outside