#linuxcnc | Logs for 2018-09-23
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[00:11:36] <pink_vampire> Tom_L: what is the cam?
[00:12:16] <Tom_L> smartcam
[00:13:40] <pink_vampire> free?
[00:13:58] <Tom_L> no
[00:14:15] <Tom_L> i bought a seat years ago
[00:14:31] <pink_vampire> how much was that?
[00:14:48] <Tom_L> back then ~6-8k
[00:14:54] <pink_vampire> WOWWWWW
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[03:18:00] <Deejay> moin
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[03:54:15] <trentster> Ello all.
[03:55:49] <Deejay> hellow there
[03:56:16] <trentster> my new cnc router machine is complete, only issue I have is racking on dual stepper Y axis. I am using 2.7 and have 2 drivers wired to the same step and direction pins on the BOB. Machine homes to 1 proximity sensor on the one side only. Homeing works fine and machine works fine until it starts to raped and then racking occurs.
[03:57:08] <trentster> I was told to go to 2.8 with dual homing, but I am wondering how this will prevent racking if its currently occuring.
[03:57:14] <trentster> Any recommendations.
[04:01:07] <trentster> lol Raped = Rapid (typo)
[04:01:40] <XXCoder> racking = both sides isnt matching each other in movements?
[04:02:19] <trentster> Yup
[04:02:50] <trentster> not sure why tho, using same ballscrews, etc
[04:03:02] <XXCoder> so lemme picture this correctly BOB => two seperate drivers => two steppers for Y?
[04:03:06] <trentster> and almost identical Leadshine drivers
[04:03:18] <trentster> XXCoder: yup correct
[04:03:48] <XXCoder> both drivers got suffecent power?
[04:04:17] <trentster> 2 seperate 48V power supplies
[04:04:38] <XXCoder> unfortunately im out of debugging ideas
[04:04:57] <trentster> XXCoder: thanks for trying mate
[04:05:08] <XXCoder> welcome
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[04:17:52] <gloops> trentster thats the wrong way to run a gantry with linuxcnc
[04:18:41] <gloops> use 2.8
[04:26:16] <gloops> racking is also a feature of gantries, it is going to rack, same power, same driver same signal blah blah - but not the same mechanical situation on either side, and different cutting forces etc
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[04:50:26] <gloops> (you are not homing the gantry btw)
[04:50:59] <XXCoder> hey trentster ?
[04:53:10] <trentster> sorry back now.
[04:53:37] <trentster> gloops: you saying problem will resolve with 2.8 or racking will occur regardless?
[04:54:22] <gloops> what im saying is, on a gantry, when the limits of the motors are reached - it will rack, thats just what they do
[04:54:23] <trentster> XXCoder: yeah… were you calling me about gloops reply?
[04:54:33] <gloops> im not sure what is causing the racking on your machine
[04:54:48] <trentster> gloops: define limits of motor is reached?
[04:55:10] <gloops> if it is racking on rapids, im guessing you have acceleration too high
[04:55:45] <gloops> trentster when one motor stalls or begins to lose steps - not enough torque to complete the task
[04:56:36] <trentster> Tomorrow I will swap both steppers to use identical Leadshine drivers. At the moment they are using slightly different ones. I will also hard set the driver amperage instead of leaving it to default. I will also put them both onto the same PSU(just incase its related)
[04:56:41] <gloops> on a gantry one motor loses steps, the gantry is now out of square, that puts pressure on the linear bearings/ballscrews, makes it harder to push
[04:57:05] <gloops> motor loses more steps, one side well out now - vicious circle, gantry jams
[04:58:04] <trentster> so, solution is to drive down the center with a single ballscrew, which kind of precludes big cnc routers being used.
[04:58:08] <gloops> the homing is important - you need to home each side indendently
[04:58:40] <gloops> no you can use 2 screws fine, just be aware of the limits
[04:59:04] <trentster> gloops: the limits being it will rack eventually?
[04:59:07] <gloops> i mean if a single screw loses position the job is still done for, it just doesnt jam the machine
[04:59:40] <gloops> yes you especially need to work within the motors limits with a gantry, use bigger motors or be sensible with speed/feed whatever
[05:00:41] <gloops> the 2.8 is better, you get independent homing, and duplicate signals
[05:01:03] <trentster> Can I upgrade to 2.8 safely from 2.7?
[05:01:23] <trentster> or does it require a totally new stepconf setup etc?
[05:01:49] <gloops> yeah, you can find it with synaptic, the config is slightly more complicated though
[05:02:41] <gloops> with 2.7 you are only homing 1 motor really, if one side has already lost steps, it will keep lost steps, you start off out of position even when homed
[05:03:03] <trentster> fyi this is the machine ive build, designed from scratch, just so we know what we are talking about: ;-)
[05:03:05] <gloops> 2.8 both motors are brought bang back to home, you start off in perfect position
[05:03:06] <trentster> http://take.ms
[05:03:37] <trentster> http://take.ms
[05:04:14] <gloops> that should work fine id say
[05:04:52] <trentster> Yeah it works great except for the racking. I guess I should be homing from both sides and will land up installing 2.8
[05:05:17] <gloops> someone in here just did it last week with no problems, hes not here now
[05:05:33] <gloops> youll probably want a bit of help with the config if you do it
[05:07:48] <trentster> gloops: yeah, that's why I have been reluctant to pull the trigger on 2.8, I can see weeks of painful wasted time in my future. ;-)
[05:08:03] <trentster> But I guess I don't have much choice now.
[05:08:30] <gloops> nah its not hard, if you have looked at the hal and ini files at all before
[05:08:39] <trentster> gloops: you remember the name of the person that did it.
[05:09:07] <gloops> i cant atm, something Turbo i think
[05:09:10] <trentster> This should help a lot: https://forum.linuxcnc.org
[05:09:20] <gloops> ive got a router working on 2.8 gantry
[05:09:49] <gloops> yeah thats the tutorial i used, 98% of the info is there
[05:11:37] <gloops> oh..the thing with updating to 2.8 - if you have any 2.7 configs you want to save - save them, it updates all configs i think as well
[05:18:01] <trentster> Thanks, I will save them for sure.
[05:19:00] <trentster> gloops: do you know of a decent how to for updating, I assume it involves adding repos for 2.8 and then doing an apt-get upgrade
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[05:27:59] <gloops> search for linuxcnc on synaptic, look for 2.8 master, it upgrades auto as i remember
[05:28:38] <gloops> not got it on this pc id have to look on the 2.8 computer how i got it
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[05:57:15] <trentster> gloops: thanks for your help.
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[06:37:27] <jthornton> morning
[06:37:33] <XXCoder> yo
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[06:47:44] <Jin^eLD> morning
[06:56:53] <Tom_L> hi
[06:57:38] <Tom_L> 57F Hi 79
[06:57:43] <Tom_L> coolin down a bit
[07:17:23] <jthornton> we are 61 with a high of 72 and rain
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[09:27:45] <gloops> trentster it was Blumax who did gantry config last week
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[10:24:51] <Blumax> gloops, i'm here !
[10:25:41] <Blumax> trentster, do you want my configuration files that works?
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[12:46:56] <fragalot> 'sup
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[12:59:19] <miss0r> 'evening
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[13:00:33] <fragalot> miss0r: rate my setup. https://photos.app.goo.gl
[13:01:28] <miss0r> Damn sturdy if I ever saw one :D
[13:01:43] <fragalot> crash proof too
[13:01:59] <miss0r> yeah :D hows'it readin?
[13:02:04] <rene_dev_> fragalot philips scales?
[13:02:06] <fragalot> worked well enough, lol
[13:02:10] <fragalot> miss0r: https://photos.app.goo.gl
[13:02:24] <fragalot> rene_dev_: "M-DRO" chinesium.. seems to work well enough for me
[13:02:36] <rene_dev_> ah
[13:02:38] <fragalot> actually the tape seemed to be a high quality brand but I can't remember what it was
[13:03:45] <miss0r> fragalot: That looks pretty damn good :)
[13:04:09] <fragalot> i found a software bug in the display though
[13:04:20] * miss0r is working on a rush order :) I have to change a 105mm socket with a 1" square hole to a 1" square hole :)
[13:04:23] <fragalot> if you hit "angle", and select XY plane it works fine
[13:04:29] <fragalot> but if you select YZ plane, it asks for a diameter
[13:04:47] <miss0r> hmm
[13:04:55] <miss0r> You sure its not a 'feature' ? :)
[13:05:07] <fragalot> going to email them to ask, lol
[13:06:01] <fragalot> https://photos.app.goo.gl YZ plane
[13:06:28] <fragalot> https://photos.app.goo.gl XY plane
[13:07:30] <miss0r> odd
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[13:21:00] <miss0r> fragalot: Have you tested the acuracy of the movement with a dial indicator?
[13:28:45] <MrHindsight> https://imgur.com
[13:31:07] <Tom_L> no cutting oil?
[13:33:06] <fragalot> not always needed
[13:33:36] <Tom_L> i would on a hss tool blank
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[13:51:26] <Rab> Consider that it's only a 50% duty cycle (maybe a little more, return stroke looks faster).
[13:51:46] <Rab> But the tool is not continuously engaged.
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[14:01:59] <flyback> that's what she said
[14:02:05] * flyback laps rab
[14:02:13] <Rab> booom
[14:02:23] <flyback> slaps
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[14:35:56] <miss0r> There we go. "upgraded" a 105mm top from 1 inch socket to 1 inch socket. The customer broke the 1" drive for the hydraulic tool, and needed it working *NOW* :) Here the time is 20:35 https://imgur.com
[14:37:00] <miss0r> MrHindsight: Do you know who is doing that shaper work? it looks interresting
[14:39:03] <fragalot> miss0r: neat :-)
[14:39:32] <miss0r> Thanks
[14:39:33] <miss0r> fragalot: Did you measure the precision of your magnetic strip with a dial indicator?
[14:39:50] <fragalot> did you make it a machinists' fit, or is it fancy to allow a greater pressure transfer?
[14:40:03] <fragalot> miss0r: not yet - I got tired of tripping over everything & started cleaning up
[14:40:08] <fragalot> will try tomorrow
[14:40:29] <miss0r> I know the feeling :) You'll then be pleased to learn that I have kept the shop clean as a whistle for the past 14 days :D
[14:40:42] <miss0r> well.. a whistle with some crud & chips in the corners :P
[14:40:43] <fragalot> I tried to get everything out the door yesterday to the tip but got sidetracked
[14:41:00] <fragalot> (ie. grandma called "can you help tile the driveway in the rain"
[14:41:01] <miss0r> Worst part about cleaning :D lol
[14:41:14] <miss0r> meh, not what I was thinking ;)
[14:41:21] <fragalot> and the GF "can you hook up that water softener"?)
[14:41:37] <fragalot> turns out also that you need to go to 4 different DIY shops to get the right fittings these days
[14:41:52] <miss0r> In my cleaning I always stumble across something I would like to do something to before putting it back in place.. so I end up doing that and forget about the cleaning :)
[14:42:04] <Tom_L> go to the old corner hardware store and get it all
[14:42:07] <miss0r> haha.. I know that feeling
[14:42:11] <fragalot> Tom_L: that shut down
[14:42:17] <fragalot> in fact, 2 shut down
[14:42:18] <Tom_L> mine did too
[14:42:21] <Tom_L> it was a sad day
[14:42:26] <fragalot> one of which had a very nice slection of hardwoods
[14:42:30] <fragalot> new one doesn't even carry pine
[14:42:42] <miss0r> wtf
[14:42:47] <fragalot> and, as it turns out, no 1" fittings
[14:43:02] <Tom_L> they carry what they figure the average dumb sh** can do on a weekend
[14:43:10] <fragalot> 1/2" only, and even then it's limited to things nobody actually needs
[14:43:28] <fragalot> and then people wonder why I always order everything online >*>
[14:43:47] <fragalot> because the local wholesalers always tell me they really prefer not to sell to me
[14:43:55] <Tom_L> i've still got a few wholesalers that sell to me which is handy
[14:43:57] <fragalot> (and they're only open 9-16)
[14:44:26] <miss0r> what the hell kind of hardware store is that?
[14:44:31] <miss0r> That is pretty good for nothing
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[14:44:50] <fragalot> not hardware store, professional industry supply dealers
[14:44:55] <Tom_L> i take that route as much as i can cause then you don't gotta deal with some dumbshit kid assigned to that department
[14:45:05] <fragalot> the hardware stores are open 10:18 typically
[14:45:21] <miss0r> 9-16 is just an odd timeframe
[14:45:31] <miss0r> The professional ones around here are like 6-15:30
[14:45:33] <fragalot> Tom_L: yeah, but the €15 shipping on that €0.85 fitting is murder.
[14:45:50] <Tom_L> no i mean wholesalers
[14:45:54] <fragalot> miss0r: some have similar hours to that, but not many
[14:46:17] <fragalot> miss0r: P.S. who thought a 1" drive was OK on a nut that size?
[14:46:31] <miss0r> I asked him about that as well.. hehe
[14:46:42] <Tom_L> took my old P166 apart this am and resoldered the ide connectors. working like a champ again
[14:47:01] <miss0r> He told me: it was meant for a.. I don't recall the name: the pneumatic one that hits it alot of times...
[14:47:05] <miss0r> I can't remember.. hehe
[14:47:19] <Tom_L> skull cracker?
[14:47:20] <miss0r> But in that case the torque would work fine. But he is using it with a hydraulic driver
[14:47:36] <miss0r> impact driver I think it is called
[14:47:44] <Tom_L> yeah
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[14:48:06] <miss0r> fragalot: You like the touch with the cold blue in the new socket? :)
[14:48:38] <fragalot> picture too dark to see that :P
[14:49:07] <miss0r> not realy.. the surface is just pitch black :D
[14:49:32] <fragalot> :)
[14:50:09] <miss0r> OR I am using my camera phone which has both oil residue & scratches on the lense.. That is what I call a quality picture :P
[14:52:29] <fragalot> anyway - magnetic scales are so much easier to install than glass ones :P
[14:52:54] <fragalot> no "oh god I hope I aligned this *PERFECTY* the first time" thoughts before you hear the scraping noise
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[14:53:24] <miss0r> :]
[14:53:33] <miss0r> The magnetic ones are alot less likely to break :)
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[17:51:58] <Deejay> gn8
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[19:44:32] <infornography> Why doesn't linuxcnc come with a calculator? *thonk*
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[20:35:02] <pink_vampire> infornography: you can use math in your g code
[20:35:41] <infornography> :(
[20:36:27] <pink_vampire> for example g0 x[#5420/2]
[20:37:35] <pink_vampire> that will read the dro value of the X axis, and will divide it by 2, and move the machine to that location on the X axis.
[20:37:39] <pink_vampire> infornography: ^
[20:39:46] <infornography> That's pretty cool, but I still would like a calculator. It's ok I can install one, it just seems odd that it is missing
[20:40:06] <infornography> WHats the #5420?
[20:42:14] <Tom_L> a variable
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[20:43:16] <infornography> *thonk*
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[20:55:37] <pink_vampire> infornography: you mean like calc.exe in windows?
[20:57:25] <infornography> like Galculator
[21:00:07] <pink_vampire> just install it.
[21:00:30] <infornography> i did
[21:01:09] <pink_vampire> so problem solved?
[21:01:40] <pink_vampire> I have very big issue with fonts
[21:02:00] <pink_vampire> someone know how to make OLF fonts?
[21:02:02] <infornography> I installed linuxcnc on a machine at work with no internet, it frustrates me sometimes. The lack of a calculator was the last thing I remember
[21:02:41] <MarcelineVQ> I just type in python2 in a terminal when I need a quick calc
[21:03:43] <infornography> :O that's pretty sweet
[21:03:46] <pink_vampire> I tried to create it in inkscape, but there is a bug in the SVG font editor that close open line.. so it is no longer One Line Font
[21:04:08] <pink_vampire> here you can see the original line, and in yellow I marked the "bug" in the SVG font editor https://i.imgur.com
[21:04:16] <pink_vampire> fter converting the SVG font to TTF the "extra line" shoe embedded in the letter, https://i.imgur.com
[21:04:26] <pink_vampire> here is other OLF font that I have just to show you how OLF font look https://i.imgur.com
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[21:18:01] <norias> hi
[21:18:11] <pink_vampire> hi
[21:18:22] <norias> how are you?
[21:19:22] <pink_vampire> working on some font issue that i have
[21:19:33] <infornography> ello
[21:19:55] <norias> font issue?
[21:20:00] <norias> hi infornography
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[21:22:20] <pink_vampire> norias: see pm
[21:22:27] <norias> ?
[21:22:36] <norias> i see nothing
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[21:37:18] <pink_vampire> something is weird, same font look different in solidworks and inkscape
[21:37:42] <pink_vampire> the font is "OLF SimpleSansOC"
[21:38:10] <pink_vampire> in solidworks https://i.imgur.com
[21:38:29] <pink_vampire> in inkscape https://i.imgur.com
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[22:01:52] <XXCoder> pink_vampire: its turning into enclosed drawing
[22:02:07] <XXCoder> it looks like it jusr connects toget ends
[22:02:19] <pink_vampire> i know,
[22:02:41] <XXCoder> you could convert it to lines then remove unnesscary lines
[22:02:56] <pink_vampire> I'm trying to make my own OLF font, and it add that extra line and close it.
[22:03:13] <XXCoder> strange
[22:04:21] <pink_vampire> I tried to use the inkscape "SVG font editor" to generate my OLF font,
[22:04:24] <norias> btw
[22:04:31] <norias> i feel compelled to mention here
[22:04:38] <norias> genericslides.com
[22:04:40] <norias> i love them
[22:04:58] <XXCoder> your site?
[22:05:35] <norias> no
[22:05:44] <norias> just one i think is pretty neat and useful
[22:06:52] <XXCoder> no prices.
[22:06:57] <XXCoder> I cant afford anything there
[22:07:02] <norias> lol
[22:07:04] <pink_vampire> 6 hours from NY
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[22:08:38] <pink_vampire> XXCoder: This is the test letter that i did in inkscape, https://i.imgur.com and you caan see the "bug
[22:08:43] <pink_vampire> " in yellow
[22:08:56] <XXCoder> yeah
[22:09:16] <pink_vampire> and this is in solidworks as TTF https://i.imgur.com
[22:09:26] <XXCoder> I wonfder if font require enclosed drawings
[22:09:58] <pink_vampire> I have other TTF fonts that are not close,
[22:10:38] <XXCoder> it works fine in inkscape?
[22:10:47] <pink_vampire> some do
[22:11:06] <XXCoder> strange. I wonder whats difference
[22:12:22] <pink_vampire> I wonder too
[22:12:38] <XXCoder> https://bugs.launchpad.net
[22:12:40] <pink_vampire> how i can send you file?
[22:14:02] <pink_vampire> Martin Owens (doctormo) on 2013-07-05 Changed in inkscape: status: Confirmed → Fix Committed
[22:14:22] <XXCoder> it was pretty old issue so not surpised its fixed
[22:14:33] <XXCoder> "Inkscape does automatically close the path of poorly formed TTF fonts."
[22:15:21] <XXCoder> check if there is "engraving type" setting somewhere in font creation
[22:16:32] <pink_vampire> "engraving type"? where? in font editor?
[22:17:11] <XXCoder> maybe, I never made any font so I wouldnt know where it would appear in, if such exists
[22:17:35] <pink_vampire> do you have inkscape?
[22:17:43] <XXCoder> yeah a second
[22:17:57] <XXCoder> its open, wjere do I start making font?
[22:18:47] <pink_vampire> click on text > svg font editor > new
[22:19:29] <pink_vampire> but it is much easyer to do it with a "starter font file"
[22:19:32] <XXCoder> okay new section appeared
[22:19:53] <pink_vampire> https://dl.orangedox.com
[22:20:31] <pink_vampire> download this svg file, and then open it in inskscape and open the font editor
[22:20:42] <XXCoder> yeah its open and dialog open
[22:21:58] <pink_vampire> do you see the letters?
[22:22:05] <XXCoder> yeah and prewview is messed up
[22:22:48] <pink_vampire> ignore the preview
[22:23:20] <XXCoder> if I enable fill it looks sane as preview
[22:23:27] <XXCoder> I dont seem to find anything yet
[22:23:52] <pink_vampire> now if you save it as svg file. and upload it to a website like https://onlinefontconverter.com you can make a TTF font
[22:24:01] <norias> hmm
[22:24:12] <norias> how many folks around here have sherline mills?
[22:24:23] <XXCoder> inkscape crashed lol
[22:24:32] <XXCoder> okay recovered lol
[22:25:18] <Tom_L> i do/did
[22:25:23] <XXCoder> all of em is named "glyph 2"
[22:25:49] <Tom_L> norias, the only thing i salvaged from it was the spindle for now
[22:26:05] <norias> Tom_L: oh, what happened?
[22:26:21] <XXCoder> changed width to 500
[22:26:52] <Tom_L> norias, that: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81
[22:27:09] <pink_vampire> XXCoder: it is not perfect.. but i did some nice fonts with it (not OLF)
[22:27:20] <norias> Tom_L: did you not like the sherline components?
[22:27:26] <Tom_L> no
[22:27:34] <norias> why not? is this common?
[22:27:46] <Tom_L> too flimzy
[22:27:50] <pink_vampire> Tom_L: there is only sherline spindle in your picture
[22:27:59] <Tom_L> i said i salvaged it
[22:28:03] <norias> but the spindle is good?
[22:28:05] <pink_vampire> norias: i have g0704
[22:28:14] <Tom_L> norias, it works but it's underpowered
[22:28:17] <norias> i'm kinda doing market research here
[22:28:31] <norias> i sort of want to make / market / sell my own hobby machine
[22:28:39] <norias> probably around the size of the sherline
[22:28:43] <pink_vampire> travel - too small.
[22:29:08] <Tom_L> i've had it for many years but finally decided to make a decent one
[22:29:14] <norias> right on
[22:29:19] <pink_vampire> i think 6040 is better
[22:29:36] <XXCoder> uploading to that site
[22:29:43] <Tom_L> http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81
[22:29:46] <Tom_L> so that was the plan
[22:30:05] <norias> looks decent
[22:30:20] <norias> lots of weldments?
[22:30:28] <Tom_L> yeah
[22:30:40] <Tom_L> but at least it's not box aluminum bolted together
[22:30:47] <norias> yeah
[22:31:06] <pink_vampire> norias: what do you want to make?
[22:31:12] <Tom_L> just made it from salvage scraps
[22:31:13] <norias> so sherline is all aluminum?
[22:31:17] <Tom_L> yep
[22:31:23] <norias> huh
[22:31:24] <Tom_L> plastic gibs
[22:31:28] <norias> no kidding
[22:31:37] <norias> i guess, to hit that $1,000 price point
[22:31:41] <norias> it almost has to be
[22:32:10] <XXCoder> pink_vampire: yeah weird look when ttf
[22:32:23] <Tom_L> there are dozens out there go good luck
[22:32:26] <pink_vampire> the HF mill I think it is better
[22:32:29] <Tom_L> so*
[22:32:30] <XXCoder> I made "bold" verson of your font
[22:32:36] <XXCoder> 16 px thickness
[22:32:51] <pink_vampire> XXCoder: LOL
[22:33:06] <norias> Tom_L: thanks
[22:33:38] <Tom_L> i can cut steel but it's pushing it
[22:33:51] <pink_vampire> norias: what materials are you going to cut?
[22:34:20] <norias> i'm thinking plastic, aluminum, mild steel
[22:34:32] <norias> dunno, pretty early in my research
[22:34:33] <pink_vampire> norias: https://i.imgur.com
[22:34:41] <XXCoder> pink_vampire: ah! https://graphicdesign.stackexchange.com
[22:34:43] <Tom_L> you'll want something at least that heavy then
[22:35:04] <norias> Tom_L: as heavy as what?
[22:35:06] <XXCoder> point 2 in illustrator, element/font info/layers
[22:35:10] <Tom_L> mine
[22:35:13] <norias> oh, ok
[22:35:25] <norias> i'm kinda looking for... what do people even want?
[22:35:26] <XXCoder> probably need to edit it in fontforge
[22:35:32] <norias> and at what price point?
[22:35:46] <Tom_L> entry level get wood routers
[22:35:55] <Tom_L> serious ones get old mills and retrofit them
[22:35:55] <pink_vampire> what is fontforge??
[22:36:01] <norias> it looks like a sherline CNC goes for $3k ish
[22:36:07] <XXCoder> i dont know, that site menions it
[22:36:09] <norias> and you say it's not good
[22:36:15] <pink_vampire> https://fontforge.github.io
[22:36:19] <XXCoder> looks like its some setting in ttf
[22:36:22] <norias> so, maybe $5-6k for good is ok?
[22:36:23] <Tom_L> i wouldn't buy another one
[22:36:33] <Tom_L> but i've had it a good 25 yrs
[22:36:49] <norias> why wouldn't you buy another?
[22:37:01] <Tom_L> not heavy enough for me
[22:37:05] <norias> ok
[22:37:07] <Tom_L> small workspace
[22:37:27] <norias> why not tormach?
[22:37:27] <Tom_L> barely cuts aluminum
[22:38:07] <Tom_L> no reason really. i wanted to build one and have a low budget
[22:38:32] <pink_vampire> tormach is nice but it is dovetail, and very short X axis
[22:38:33] <norias> right on
[22:38:42] <norias> what's wrong with dovetail?
[22:39:15] <XXCoder> I watched one video of guy ranting about tomach issues
[22:39:45] <norias> ha!
[22:39:59] <pink_vampire> the cnc motion kill them unevenly
[22:40:25] <Wolf__> XXCoder: the guy who tried to get one for light industrial use?
[22:40:36] <Tom_L> just about everything someone builds to sell out there is a gantry design
[22:40:40] <XXCoder> Wolf__: no idea?
[22:40:48] <XXCoder> its been a bit since I last saw
[22:41:07] <pink_vampire> norias: I just get 60K spindle. you will be happy.
[22:41:17] <norias> heh
[22:41:30] <pink_vampire> or not https://i.imgur.com
[22:41:32] <Tom_L> pink_vampire until you try to tap with it or drill holes
[22:41:38] <XXCoder> 60k rpm?
[22:41:54] <XXCoder> flying tools is so fun
[22:41:57] <Tom_L> could have been your eye
[22:42:10] <Wolf__> HF spindle isnt the answer to everything
[22:42:15] <pink_vampire> not so fast, i have PP
[22:43:00] <pink_vampire> Wolf__: the slow spindle is much better ad can compactor
[22:43:05] <pink_vampire> as*
[22:43:20] <Wolf__> XXCoder: https://youtu.be this is the vid that came to mind about tormach rants
[22:43:32] <XXCoder> yep him
[22:43:35] <XXCoder> mr shiny eyes
[22:43:56] <pink_vampire> XXCoder: lol
[22:44:43] <norias> oh good
[22:44:45] <norias> tormach rant
[22:44:49] <norias> i like this
[22:45:39] <Wolf__> he makes a good point to get a Haas in another video lol
[22:45:53] <norias> lol
[22:45:58] <XXCoder> haas ehhh
[22:46:01] <XXCoder> never really liked em
[22:46:04] <norias> haas is fine
[22:46:10] <XXCoder> in least its not hurco
[22:46:22] <norias> lol
[22:46:39] <pink_vampire> norias: if your material is a sheet form - get something like 6040, if you need to place a 4-6" machinist vise, you need a benchtop mill.
[22:46:51] <XXCoder> my first professional run I started with some ancient machine then hurco
[22:46:55] <XXCoder> thought those was fine
[22:46:55] <norias> pink_vampire: i think you misunderstand
[22:47:02] <norias> i'm not buying a machine
[22:47:10] <norias> i'm designing / making / selling a machine
[22:47:12] <norias> maybe
[22:47:12] <XXCoder> till I ran fadal 88. this machine is ancient and still better than hurco
[22:47:14] <Wolf__> 6” machine vise isnt going on a bench top
[22:48:39] <pink_vampire> i have the 5" and sure you can put 6" it will take half of the table..
[22:48:57] <Wolf__> and eat all the Z travel on a bench top mill
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[22:49:43] <pink_vampire> it will take few inches.
[22:50:14] <pink_vampire> so from 12" you will get 6" for tools
[22:52:31] <Wolf__> norias: i think it really comes down to what your end user target is..
[22:52:44] <Wolf__> for what type/size machine
[22:52:47] <norias> Wolf__: yeah, i think you are right
[22:54:09] <norias> i'm thinking it might make more sense to compete with tormach
[22:56:12] <Wolf__> x1 taig sherline sized machine might be ok for a hobbyist, maybe something hair smaller then a 770 but designed at the core to be a cnc only might be a good start
[22:57:12] <norias> makes sense
[22:57:20] <norias> let me look that up
[22:57:44] <norias> oh, tormach 770
[22:58:01] <Wolf__> pretty sure the tormach machines are all actually cnc conversions
[22:58:24] <pink_vampire> Wolf__: they are.
[22:58:38] <norias> the tormach 440 is smaller
[22:59:05] <norias> i think that's about what i'd be targetting
[22:59:27] <norias> seems roughly the same working area as the taig's
[22:59:34] <norias> or sherline
[22:59:42] <norias> (i really don't know this market, yet)
[22:59:53] <pink_vampire> i did a comperation between my g0704 and the tormach 440, and the g0704 is longer on the X, higher on the Z, faster with the servos, ans cost less.
[23:01:25] <norias> how much do they cost w/ cnc?
[23:02:09] <pink_vampire> if you convert it is is up to you,
[23:02:18] <norias> uh, i see
[23:02:31] <norias> yeah, i would not even touch trying to sell a manual machine
[23:02:46] <norias> this would be cnc from the start
[23:03:56] <XXCoder> https://www.youtube.com interesting
[23:18:27] <Jymmm> XXCoder: slicing a tomatoe, not bad at all for rebar
[23:18:33] <XXCoder> yeah
[23:18:39] <XXCoder> rebar is all mystery metal
[23:18:50] <Jymmm> XXCoder: what did he spray on it ? patina something???
[23:18:51] <XXCoder> and it isnt even same across entire length
[23:18:56] <XXCoder> no idea
[23:19:00] <Jymmm> heh
[23:19:11] <XXCoder> it looked darker where he didnt grind after spray so I guess so?
[23:22:09] <Tom_L> norias make sure it's got a tool changer :)
[23:22:18] <XXCoder> yes!
[23:22:20] <norias> that's what i'm thinking
[23:22:38] <norias> it's not worth doing without a tool changer
[23:22:42] <Tom_L> small collet holders with retention knobs
[23:22:45] <XXCoder> norias: what is your machine price range?
[23:22:58] <pink_vampire> Tom_L: it is not very practical if you only make one part
[23:23:02] <norias> i'm looking at what other machines sell for
[23:23:11] <norias> i think i'm going to have to do the tormach price range
[23:23:13] <Tom_L> pink_vampire, neither is cnc
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[23:23:32] <norias> what, like around $10k
[23:23:45] <pink_vampire> get hass mini mill
[23:24:00] <norias> those are more like $40k
[23:24:03] <XXCoder> 10k is bit above my range drat
[23:24:14] <norias> XXCoder, ok i'm curious
[23:24:15] <XXCoder> used ones is too much work to get working
[23:24:18] <Tom_L> a bit above quite a few's budget
[23:24:22] <norias> what is your price range
[23:24:27] <norias> and what do you expect for it?
[23:24:30] <pink_vampire> they start at 20K~
[23:24:44] <XXCoder> nothing you can sell and expect profit unfortunately lol I know im not being relistic
[23:24:47] <norias> (although, obviously tormach does business at $10k)
[23:25:00] <norias> XXCoder: who knows, try me.
[23:25:06] <norias> it's all market research, right now
[23:25:23] <XXCoder> though it would be interesting to see machine like pocketnc but with only 3 axes and lower price point
[23:25:29] <norias> i've played with tormach's before, and i know i can crush them
[23:25:31] <pink_vampire> norias: those also very good machines http://www.syilamerica.com
[23:25:40] <XXCoder> and addons to add one of rotatry axes
[23:25:54] <pink_vampire> http://www.syilamerica.com
[23:26:09] <XXCoder> 6.5k for small machine interesting
[23:26:16] <norias> pink_vampire: good link, thanks.
[23:26:35] <XXCoder> norias: I hope my job shop gives away office mill haas lol
[23:26:43] <norias> heh
[23:26:44] <XXCoder> tiny machine but it can be plugged in to 220v
[23:26:58] <pink_vampire> https://cdn.websites.hibu.com
[23:27:27] <norias> haas doesn't do the office mill anymore
[23:28:04] <XXCoder> https://www.youtube.com
[23:28:08] <XXCoder> its at their site
[23:28:15] <pink_vampire> cm1
[23:28:17] <pink_vampire> cm2
[23:29:11] <pink_vampire> norias: https://www.haascnc.com
[23:29:30] <norias> huh. i thought they stopped
[23:29:32] <XXCoder> one in video is more modern version than ones at work
[23:29:39] <XXCoder> ones at work is belige
[23:29:53] <pink_vampire> look what "amazing " cutting quality https://www.haascnc.com
[23:30:06] <norias> lol
[23:30:20] <norias> i like the workholding, thought
[23:30:20] <XXCoder> middle one way too much sideload for machine
[23:30:23] <norias> though
[23:30:26] <XXCoder> last one is decent
[23:30:43] <XXCoder> it might be just roughing in middle though
[23:31:05] <XXCoder> anyway om is NOT prouction machine
[23:31:07] <pink_vampire> XXCoder: also the dent in holder
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[23:31:23] <XXCoder> we made thousands of parts in those, and both machine needed servicing and expensive ones too
[23:31:41] <XXCoder> ya that happens, someone wasnt carefu
[23:31:42] <pink_vampire> I think it is mount on 4/5 axis
[23:31:48] <XXCoder> it is
[23:32:28] <pink_vampire> why i'm not making the last part for my spindle?? whyyyy
[23:33:44] <pink_vampire> i need to index it in 60 degrees on my mill and drill 3 holes
[23:35:17] <norias> ok
[23:35:18] <norias> well
[23:35:21] <norias> i should sleep
[23:35:31] <XXCoder> later :)
[23:36:20] <pink_vampire> XXCoder: do you have an idea?
[23:36:36] <XXCoder> is it only one side at 60 degrees?
[23:36:44] <pink_vampire> 3 sides
[23:37:10] <XXCoder> hmm how large is it?
[23:37:23] <pink_vampire> for 8-32 screw
[23:37:29] <pink_vampire> 1/2
[23:37:35] <pink_vampire> 1/2" deep
[23:37:42] <XXCoder> I mean part itself
[23:37:50] -!- norias has quit [Quit: Leaving]
[23:38:20] <XXCoder> do you have sine plate? if its more narrow than part you could use it to angle part and jaws grip part in it
[23:38:41] <pink_vampire> the part is the pulley
[23:39:08] <pink_vampire> i have, but for 60 deg.. it is pushing it.
[23:40:01] <XXCoder> I cant picture where holes needs to be added
[23:40:09] <XXCoder> so I cant think up a fixture type
[23:40:22] <pink_vampire> one sec' i will draw it
[23:44:04] <pink_vampire> XXCoder: you made me making the part <3
[23:45:14] <XXCoder> :)
[23:52:17] <pink_vampire> 12 screws..
[23:53:27] <pink_vampire> XXCoder: https://i.imgur.com
[23:53:37] <XXCoder> looking
[23:53:49] <XXCoder> HMM yeah I see
[23:54:02] <XXCoder> is oppositing holes aligned to each other?
[23:54:14] <pink_vampire> this is the 6x6 version
[23:54:31] <pink_vampire> and i think maybe to do only 3x3
[23:54:40] <XXCoder> I think I have a idea
[23:55:04] <XXCoder> depends on if youre willing to make fixture for it
[23:55:25] <XXCoder> the top 4 holes can be used as aligning if it is in square pattern
[23:56:01] <XXCoder> so all you need to do is pins horzional for holes for "far" and near" holes as its 90 degrees and easy
[23:56:38] <XXCoder> then another pins pattern for other 2, you use cnc mill to drill holes in specific pattern in such way that you insert pins and part when inserted into it is angled in 60 degrees
[23:56:48] <XXCoder> then flip part around for other one
[23:56:49] <XXCoder> done
[23:57:28] <XXCoder> so you put one jaw on its side upwards, mill holes for horzional AND 60 degree angled
[23:57:36] <XXCoder> make sure pins fit in it tightly
[23:57:46] <XXCoder> part should also fit pins tightly
[23:58:04] <pink_vampire> yeah' but how i will hold it in the milling?
[23:58:06] <XXCoder> its to hold part in correct angle as you clamp jaws on part
[23:58:16] <XXCoder> ok lemme make picture, quick
[23:58:24] <pink_vampire> https://i.imgur.com
[23:58:31] <pink_vampire> this is in the assamble