#linuxcnc | Logs for 2018-10-22

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[06:14:22] <jthornton> morning
[06:16:04] <Tom_L> morning
[06:17:12] <MarcelineVQ> Tried to make caramel popcorn today, ended up with popcorn brittle <_<
[06:17:36] <MarcelineVQ> Not a loss but not a win, normal day.
[06:18:49] <Tom_L> 48�F Hi 72
[06:20:17] <jthornton> 34°F high 64°F
[06:20:33] <jthornton> frost killed all my raised bed plants yesterday
[06:20:58] <MarcelineVQ> What were you growing?
[06:21:29] <jthornton> turnips is the only thing growing now :)
[06:21:43] <MarcelineVQ> hehe nice, beets here
[06:22:07] <MarcelineVQ> beats and butternut squash are all that's finishing up out there
[06:23:04] <MarcelineVQ> with garlic in the ground for next season, home grown hard-neck garlic is so worth it
[06:23:09] <jthornton> I was growing several types of tomatoes, cucumber, and a sweet potato... dang zucchini didn't do anything but flower a lot
[06:24:22] <jthornton> I'm in zone 7a where are you located at?
[06:24:27] <MarcelineVQ> sounds like we do similar gardens
[06:24:46] <MarcelineVQ> No one's ever asked me that before, let me find out
[06:25:47] <MarcelineVQ> 8b-ish
[06:26:19] <jthornton> I have a large one but need to get deer fence up it's about 2,500 square feet or so and very late this year I built a raised bed next to the carport
[06:26:20] <MarcelineVQ> Broccoli did very well here this year
[06:27:18] <MarcelineVQ> We put higher deer fence this year that we have had before and the deer decided to go under it instead, the vermin
[06:27:30] <MarcelineVQ> Ate all our pod-beans
[06:27:52] <jthornton> add a hot wire, you need it for climbers anyway
[06:28:39] <MarcelineVQ> It's just small enough a garden that that's a hassle, we've just weighted the bottom of the net for now hehe
[06:29:13] <MarcelineVQ> As far as non-insect animals go we don't have much in the way of pests here, so far
[06:29:46] <MarcelineVQ> The racoons don't seem to realize the garden is food, and the rats seem attracted to our traps
[06:30:53] <jthornton> I have some wood rats that like to eat my truck wiring but I've failed to catch them with every trap I can think of even a few I borrowed from the university of Il lol
[06:30:57] <MarcelineVQ> Just put in automatic watering this year, man is that nice
[06:31:30] <jthornton> aye I put one on the raised bed but my faucet water is a bit silty so I had to put a filter before it
[06:31:43] <jthornton> how often did you water?
[06:32:22] <MarcelineVQ> pretty much every morning, and often a little before sundown as well
[06:32:47] <MarcelineVQ> It's much nicer to have more consistent watering now, especially since it's less effort on top
[06:33:09] <jthornton> I set mine for 15 minutes every 4 hours for the raised bed
[06:33:10] <MarcelineVQ> this is the kind of rodent trap we use, in mouse and rat size https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com not this image exactly but that style of trap
[06:33:42] <jthornton> yea I have a few of those for mice
[06:34:10] <jthornton> https://www.amazon.com
[06:34:50] <MarcelineVQ> ehe classic but I've never found those especially effective for the rodents here
[06:35:13] <MarcelineVQ> I think this house has some victors in the rafters come to think of it
[06:35:49] <MarcelineVQ> What kind of watering is your setup?
[06:36:12] <jthornton> I have a dozen sorta like this one but no holes http://pestcontrolshop.co.za
[06:36:38] <jthornton> it's a hmmm forget the brand let me look
[06:36:55] <MarcelineVQ> I just mean the style, like drip or soaker hose, etc
[06:37:22] <jthornton> oh I put these little sprinkler heads that cover like 1 sq foot or so
[06:38:25] <MarcelineVQ> We used soaker-hosed buried a few inches down, with the idea being that the plants roots would be more inclined to seek downwards.
[06:38:29] <MarcelineVQ> Worked quite well, but I can tell by the lawn growth that much water was wasted so we're gonna try having them near the surface next year so the water has more time to get trapped in the soil instead of leaving right into the lawn.
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[06:39:19] <MarcelineVQ> You tend to get more leaf disease by watering top-down which was another reason we wanted to try a buried hose
[06:40:18] <jthornton> leaves turning black or something?
[06:40:43] <XXCoder> hey jthornton
[06:40:44] <MarcelineVQ> Soemtimes, depends on the plant, but typically it'll be some fungus.
[06:41:05] <Tom_L> not watering too much are you?
[06:41:13] <XXCoder> MarcelineVQ: didnt know that. interesting
[06:41:19] <jthornton> I have some stuff I spray for any fungus and it just kills it for the year
[06:41:20] <MarcelineVQ> Gardens sure can tell the difference between being watered and being rained on though, the beets go nuts (in a good way) after a good rain here
[06:41:29] <jthornton> hey XXCoder
[06:41:46] <jthornton> ah yea it was rain bird stuff I used
[06:41:54] <Tom_L> i put cucumbers in cages like tomatoes, seem to do alot better
[06:42:05] <Tom_L> let them hang instead of on the ground
[06:42:06] <jthornton> cages?
[06:42:11] <MarcelineVQ> jthornton: virkon?
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[06:42:17] <Tom_L> wire fence
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[06:42:57] <MarcelineVQ> We made a tressle for the tomatos and cucumbers and squash to climb
[06:43:05] <MarcelineVQ> trellis?
[06:43:08] <MarcelineVQ> I mix those two up
[06:43:16] <Tom_L> http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81
[06:43:18] <Tom_L> old pic
[06:43:24] <MarcelineVQ> yeah trellis
[06:43:41] <Tom_L> kids toys are cad cam now if that tells
[06:44:18] <jthornton> ah yea I have a cattle panel trelles for the cucumbers and zucchini
[06:44:39] <Tom_L> i made mine different diameters for storage
[06:45:10] <jthornton> have you guys bought seeds from Baker Seeds?
[06:45:27] <Tom_L> i haven't had a garden in a while now but no
[06:46:05] <jthornton> https://www.rareseeds.com
[06:46:13] <jthornton> you can get a free catalog
[06:46:14] <MarcelineVQ> Not directly, can't rule out being sold them under a different name though
[06:46:22] <Tom_L> my old neighbor used to get all sorts of stuff mail order
[06:46:28] <Tom_L> not sure where she got them
[06:46:33] <jthornton> they are here in Missouri
[06:46:56] <jthornton> the Cherokee Purple tomatoes are really good
[06:47:41] <Tom_L> she used to do the whole yard in garden and always had something in it she ordered
[06:48:10] <jthornton> http://gnipsel.com
[06:48:18] <jthornton> that's the big garden
[06:48:29] <Tom_L> you've got alot more space
[06:48:45] <Tom_L> do the trees affect what grows good?
[06:49:18] <jthornton> not too many trees on the east side so it gets full sun up till the afternoon
[06:49:26] <jthornton> http://gnipsel.com
[06:49:39] <jthornton> that was a lot of work spreading compost
[06:49:42] <MarcelineVQ> Goddamn, wish I had a tiller like that
[06:50:03] <jthornton> http://gnipsel.com
[06:50:26] <jthornton> that was a huge waste of time and money... didn't read the package well on the weed blocker
[06:50:35] <jthornton> not uv resistant lol
[06:50:57] <Tom_L> i put grass clippings down for weed control
[06:51:18] <jthornton> as a mat on top?
[06:51:24] <Tom_L> yeah
[06:51:51] <jthornton> I don't have enough grass lol, I just have trails through the woods mostly and that one open spot where the garden is
[06:52:06] <MarcelineVQ> We tried alfalfa for that, easy to get, nutrictious, worked fairly well but did tend to attract slug
[06:52:26] * jthornton wonders why we didn't have this conversation last spring lol
[06:52:29] <Tom_L> yeah that works too
[06:53:05] <Tom_L> i put a little alfalfa around the potatoe cuttings in the hole as well
[06:53:35] <Tom_L> shake them in a bag of sulfur first to keep them from rotting
[06:55:19] <MarcelineVQ> I gotta look up how to grow potatoes well come to think of it, we had an okay crop this year, certainly enough to eat all winter. But it wasn't really worth the resources they used, so if I could get away with the same yeild on less plants it'd be great
[06:55:48] <MarcelineVQ> Need to make friends with an irishman
[06:56:37] <jthornton> they grow potatoes east of me in the flat ground area of the old mississippi flood plains
[06:56:40] <Tom_L> did horse radish one year. alot sweeter than store bought
[06:56:50] <jthornton> they need a soft soil I think
[06:56:56] <MarcelineVQ> Even bad garden grown beats good store bought
[06:57:06] <Tom_L> i put them in mounds
[06:57:47] <Tom_L> helps keep the soil from packing in too much
[06:58:01] <MarcelineVQ> We had plenty of top-growth, and it was deep soil, something about the nutrition balance was likely off. But I'm not sure what, I've seen people grow potatos in pure horseshit and that's just nitrogen :(
[06:58:26] <XXCoder> dont pototoes like poor soil?
[06:58:43] <XXCoder> or was it some other plant
[06:58:47] <Tom_L> mine did ok
[06:59:02] <jthornton> dunno what kind of soil is in Idaho lol
[06:59:28] <Tom_L> one year i had well over 200 cucumbers off 6 cages
[07:00:05] <Tom_L> never could grow carrots
[07:00:51] <XXCoder> nice. too bad on carrots
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[07:09:11] <merkatorix> To measure the tool height: Can I just screw a microswitch somewhere, programm linuxcnc, so it knows the position and then linuxcnc can first home itself and then measure the length of the tool automatically?
[07:12:23] <XXCoder> theres few schemes that do that
[07:13:07] <XXCoder> theres one that use laser for rough measurement then use touchpad for more accurate measurement. in video it then rapids right to top of vise. scary.
[07:13:23] <miss0r> merkatorix: The problem is the inacuracy of the microswitch
[07:15:03] <miss0r> i.e. The repeatability is not very good in such a contact
[07:16:15] <merkatorix> Should I just buy such a tool-length Sensor? https://shop.stepcraft-systems.com
[07:16:52] <miss0r> Depending on the build quality those can be realy good. Also used in mid-high end systems(the very well build ones)
[07:17:06] <miss0r> But sure. That should easily land you with a repeatability of a few 1/100mm
[07:17:06] <merkatorix> That one costs 40€
[07:17:53] <miss0r> Price is not the best test to see if something is build crappy. But it is a good indicator. Depending on what you want to do, that thing might be alright
[07:19:38] <miss0r> Back to the mill. I have a new bushing to do. bbl
[07:21:18] <XXCoder> I hate searching for cnc stuff on google
[07:21:32] <XXCoder> it brings so many buy buy stuff that its impossible to find good pages
[07:31:43] <jthornton> yea so much crap now a days in a search lol I tried to find a fajitas marinade recipe the other day and all the hits were a zillion photos like one with a knife near a tomato one with the knife slicing the tomato lol
[07:33:08] <XXCoder> lol
[07:33:22] <XXCoder> tried direct yt search. failed
[07:33:26] <XXCoder> video is bit old
[07:33:31] <XXCoder> also very very scary at end lol
[07:35:14] <jthornton> gotta keep an eye on the clock had an egg laid from the roost yesterday so need to be Johnny on the spot to scoop it up if I have one today
[07:45:40] <XXCoder> fun
[07:49:53] <rmu> merkatorix: i know that thing, internally, it is a microswitch
[07:50:28] <rmu> but i don't have data on repeatability, i only use it to get a ballpark-figure that needs to be withing +0.2mm
[07:50:32] <rmu> +-
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[07:51:57] <Jin^eLD> hi
[07:57:14] * Loetmichel thinks that doesent look even half bad for first time printing PETG... and no stringing... consider me surprised... -> https://www.youtube.com
[07:57:42] <XXCoder> that is quite decent
[07:58:51] <jthornton> I like your cooling fan for the hot end
[08:00:50] <Jin^eLD> so, to come back to my machine CB story... turned out it was the relay, it was too weak to trigger the on/off mechanism; the actual CB works, but its an old model so can't buy a new relay for it; good news is that the machine itself works :)
[08:03:34] <jthornton> XXCoder: I got the light code consolidated yesterday and this is the output https://paste.ubuntu.com
[08:03:54] <XXCoder> looking
[08:04:14] <jthornton> and the code https://paste.ubuntu.com
[08:05:12] <jthornton> reduced it down to 3 tests to see what part of the year I'm in
[08:05:26] <XXCoder> 13.13 total light
[08:05:30] <XXCoder> nice
[08:05:36] <XXCoder> seems it works fine
[08:05:46] <jthornton> yea I'm happy with it
[08:06:15] <jthornton> I just need my gear motor from china to show up so I can build a new door and test it
[08:08:07] <Loetmichel> jthornton: thats stock on the Anet A8
[08:08:21] <Loetmichel> or did you mean the nozzle for the part cooling fan?
[08:08:36] <jthornton> the fan on the right side that cools the printed part
[08:08:50] <Loetmichel> thats the part cooling fan
[08:08:58] <Loetmichel> the extruder fan is on the left
[08:09:18] <Loetmichel> and its stock, too, just a printed nozzle on it
[08:09:59] <Loetmichel> (and i need to get such a "silicone sock" for the hotend, because the heater struggles to maintain 230°c when the part cooling fan spins up after the second layer
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[08:20:59] <miss0r> I just turned 5 of 7 bronce bushings I'm doing here. AND NOW I realize I misread a number. !
[08:21:03] <miss0r> Back to square one
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[08:23:56] <miss0r> also, while I am ranting; How come I do not have a 16mm reamer?! I am boring these out :)
[08:23:58] <miss0r> bah!
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[08:41:40] <flyback> <miss0r> I just turned 5 of 7 bronce bushings I'm doing here. AND NOW I realize I misread a number. !
[08:41:40] <flyback> <miss0r> Back to square one
[08:41:43] <flyback> *CANUCKED*
[08:41:59] * flyback rubs rue_mohr against miss0r's failed project
[08:42:53] <flyback> na seriously that sucks:(
[08:43:12] <flyback> I worked for a circuit assembly company a few months and I put in the wrong resisotor wheel
[08:43:23] <gregcnc> read print twice, cut once?
[08:43:36] <flyback> guy had to redo 768 parts by hand
[08:43:45] <flyback> I quit
[08:44:12] <flyback> was a good decision now that I look back
[08:44:31] <flyback> cause my mind has deteriated to the point I am too absent minded for doing realtime like that
[08:44:36] <flyback> but fine for IT work
[08:45:10] <flyback> miss0r, that's neat shit btw
[08:45:26] <flyback> I never knew people use lathes etc for old parts as well as new feedstock
[08:45:44] <flyback> regrinding old drive shafts, cranks, etc to refurb them
[08:46:12] <gregcnc> sometimes people even use lathes to rework parts they just made new
[08:46:26] <flyback> hehehe yeah it's called "oops"
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[08:47:55] <flyback> but it's neat watching them save a $40,000 packard cam shaft by shaving off the rot
[08:48:10] <flyback> unfortunitely the idiots in shipping dropped it
[08:48:16] <flyback> being cast iron instant shatter
[08:49:11] <miss0r> Yeah, it sucks :)
[08:49:17] <miss0r> First 'real' one is complete now
[08:49:39] <miss0r> flyback: I do alot of bushings'n regrind & repair work in my shop.
[08:49:49] <flyback> cool
[08:50:00] <flyback> much respect
[08:50:02] <miss0r> Mostly for the machines I repair at clients, but also the odd job walks in the door from time to time
[08:50:23] <miss0r> Thanks, though; I'm not sure I deserve it ;)
[08:50:35] <flyback> yeha you do
[08:50:55] <flyback> being able to save machines like that is a magical art :)
[08:51:18] <miss0r> I am known for having magical gell in my pockets.
[08:51:19] <miss0r> :)
[08:51:46] <miss0r> One day I hope to be as great as the realy good ones doing this stuff
[08:52:30] <flyback> I watched this auto show where they diamond cut these bmw rims
[08:52:43] <flyback> I thin it costy them $100/each but new rims were like $500 each
[08:53:03] <miss0r> nice :]
[08:53:15] <flyback> so they saved them by just grind off the top layer of rot
[08:53:31] <miss0r> I used to do alot of spare parts for the veteran car club down the road. but I haven't seen much of that stuff since they closed down
[08:53:43] <miss0r> I love stuff like that
[08:54:00] <miss0r> I guess my buisness boils down to; love of old iron
[08:54:10] <flyback> cool
[08:54:43] <flyback> have you seen the people who cnc wood bearings
[08:55:03] <miss0r> Once in a while I do a repair on a modern CNC machine, but 90% of what I do are on manual or semi automatic machines from 1941 to 1982 :)
[08:55:03] <flyback> using this special wood that doesn't rot in water and forms it's own lube
[08:55:05] <miss0r> I have not
[08:55:11] <miss0r> Interresting
[08:55:23] <flyback> used for some hydro plants
[08:55:31] <miss0r> You wouldn't happen to have a youtube link or something? :)
[08:55:44] <flyback> lignum vitae bearings
[08:55:46] <flyback> yes
[08:55:49] <flyback> gettying them now
[08:56:12] <flyback> bear with me
[08:56:14] <flyback> Client: HexChat 2.14.1 • OS: Ubuntu "bionic" 18.04 • CPU: AMD Athlon(tm) XP Processor 3000+ (1.60GHz) • Memory: Physical: 1.4 GiB Total (864.8 MiB Free) Swap: 2.6 GiB Total (2.5 GiB Free) • Storage: 13.9 GB / 153.4 GB (139.5 GB Free) • VGA: NVIDIA Corporation NV17M [GeForce4 420 Go 32M] @ NVIDIA Corporation nForce3 Host Bridge • Uptime: 5d 9h 41m 18s
[08:56:24] <flyback> it's very slow my main systems are all packed for moving
[08:57:03] <miss0r> I'll wait :] I am doing measurements on the worn out bearing plate as we speak. I need to bore it for the bushing
[08:57:09] <flyback> https://www.hydroworld.com
[08:58:32] <miss0r> o.0
[08:59:05] <miss0r> Very nice :] Sadly I don't have any hydroplant clients :) But I will read this entire article later. :) I find this stuff quite interresting
[09:02:16] <flyback> very expensive wood but the shit will just run 50 yrs or more without issue
[09:02:57] <miss0r> quite worth the cost, one would think :)
[09:03:02] <flyback> needs water though so other apps it would not be ideal
[09:03:43] <flyback> https://www.frenchriverland.com
[09:03:52] <flyback> these guys refurb abandoned hydroplants
[09:04:00] <flyback> or salvage turbines etc
[09:04:06] <flyback> they do tons of cnc work to fix them
[09:04:09] <miss0r> abandoned hydroplants :D haha
[09:04:16] <flyback> they obtained this giant boring mill
[09:04:26] <flyback> I mean the thing is huge like small garage
[09:04:41] <flyback> they had to break it down into pieces etc but it was worth it
[09:04:51] <flyback> cause it can work giant prop shafts
[09:05:07] <miss0r> I'm thinking: shouldn't this bearing/seal also apply to ships?
[09:05:18] <flyback> they do
[09:05:18] <flyback> :)
[09:05:47] <miss0r> I wouldn't mind having to do a little work for them :) That looks realy cool
[09:07:22] <flyback> miss0r, http://www.cantierenoe.it
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[09:08:51] <miss0r> damn. Now; doing stuff like that requires a phat wallet
[09:08:53] <flyback> https://www.core77.com
[09:09:22] <flyback> yeah it's not cheap but for some apps it's worth it
[09:10:00] <miss0r> I should get some :D Just in case I need to repair a boat screw bearing again :D
[09:10:01] <miss0r> hehe
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[09:11:07] <flyback> it's just weird to see a steel shaft rideing in a block of wood
[09:11:17] <flyback> but it works fine in apps with water
[09:11:46] <miss0r> Indeed :)
[09:11:53] <miss0r> I mainly do steel :D
[09:12:06] <miss0r> it VERY RARE that I do anything that has to do with water.
[09:12:18] <miss0r> most of my stuff is covered in hydraulics
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[09:15:36] <flyback> nothing wrong with steel etc
[09:15:43] <flyback> I wasn't suggesting otherwise
[09:16:15] <miss0r> I know :) I was just dreaming of using the wood solution :)
[09:16:20] <flyback> like I said the wood bearings are strictly for submerged water apps
[09:16:26] <miss0r> Basically just shot down my own dreams out loud
[09:17:00] <miss0r> But I will keep it in mind, for sure :D That is one of those things that can make people drow their jaws, like I just did
[09:18:22] <flyback> do you get to do any fluid bearing stuff?
[09:18:38] <miss0r> some
[09:18:42] <flyback> basically sleeve bearings that form a hydrolyric layer with oil
[09:18:50] <flyback> cool
[09:19:17] <miss0r> but with most of them, they are readily available for purchase.
[09:19:47] <miss0r> I realy only do the parts that are not sold anymore. I could never compete with a modern serial production
[09:19:57] <flyback> oh I think there will always be times where people like you are needed
[09:20:17] <flyback> even with ready made parts, might need adjustment to compensate for damage on a systyem
[09:20:20] <flyback> warpage etc
[09:20:21] <miss0r> I hope so :) This is my full time job now
[09:20:33] <flyback> or needing to mod a ready made part to work in another unit
[09:21:01] <miss0r> I've been doing small repairs & projects since 2014(started my company there). I've only been doing this fulltime since march of this spring
[09:21:09] <flyback> cool
[09:22:11] <miss0r> Sure :) I love it. Ans so far, clients with work have not been an issue. I just hope it lasts :D
[09:22:53] <flyback> any particular machine you repair the most?
[09:23:00] <flyback> engines? mills? etc?
[09:23:44] <miss0r> Mostly gear cutters, hobbers & grinders.
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[09:23:51] <flyback> cool!
[09:24:01] <miss0r> Also alot of milling machines & boring mills
[09:24:08] <miss0r> & also alot of lathe work
[09:24:14] <flyback> oh you will defintely like this link hang on
[09:24:36] <flyback> bah the page is no more
[09:24:42] <miss0r> sad :-/
[09:25:33] <Glorfindel> check the wayback machine?
[09:25:59] <flyback> how do I check that
[09:26:38] <flyback> http://picasaweb.google.com
[09:26:40] <flyback> dead link
[09:27:45] <miss0r> :-/
[09:27:56] <miss0r> This stuff happens all of the time, sadly.
[09:28:14] <miss0r> Alot of the 'old' interresting stuff is going away, as noone cares for keeping it afloat
[09:29:54] <flyback> I know they went out of their way to get that old mill
[09:29:55] <Glorfindel> flyback: web.archive.org
[09:30:00] <miss0r> Damn this bore is mangled... I hope I can find a good center :S
[09:30:03] <Glorfindel> they don't have it though :(
[09:32:19] <flyback> it was all beat up and huge and had to be broken into pieces for transport
[09:32:23] <flyback> and they had to rehab it
[09:32:30] <flyback> but it was worth it I guess
[09:32:36] <flyback> cause it can do large pieces at once
[09:35:49] <miss0r> yeah :) I service a large boring mill. It is 12meters long 8 meters high and has a boring reach of 2.75 meters
[09:36:06] <miss0r> I had to do ALOT of work on it, as the owner also bought it for next to nothing, and it was in bad shape.
[09:36:39] <miss0r> it is still not great, though. I need to replace two clutches before I can call the job complete, but the mill is too busy working on a large order at the moment
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[09:39:21] <flyback> cool
[09:39:30] <flyback> must be cool to get something working like that again
[09:39:37] <flyback> hearing the first startup
[09:40:06] <miss0r> It is. But it is also alot of hard work :)
[09:40:24] <miss0r> Alot of the bolts on there uses a 105mm heads
[09:40:39] <miss0r> You need alot of hydraulic equipment to work them :D
[09:41:06] <miss0r> bah. This bearing plate is seven different kinds of warped. I need to put it in the mill to stand a chance
[09:41:18] <flyback> be careful around hydrolics and high pressure grease guns
[09:41:38] <miss0r> trust me, I am :)
[09:41:38] <flyback> people have injected grease and fluids into muscle or blood
[09:41:41] <flyback> not a good way to go
[09:41:59] <miss0r> Yeah. My dad told me stories about that since I was 5 - I've been realy carefull ever since :D
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[12:43:55] <Tom_L> flyback, hedge wood has also been used for bearings in some things
[12:48:49] <miss0r> Finally; now I am done with the rest of the bushings. They are all fitted. and all but one is sent out the door :]
[12:48:56] <miss0r> (the last one I have to go install tomorrow)
[12:50:52] <miss0r> 2x M3 socket screws holding the bushing in place, so it do not rotate. I had to shorten a 2.5mm drillbit down to 7mm spiral, to keep it from wandering into the brass, away from the cast iron
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[13:41:13] <fragalot> Hi
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[13:44:08] <mk0> hallo2. i am very sorry for repeating, tried to ask from phone
[13:44:12] <mk0> oh
[13:44:45] <gloops> hello
[13:44:57] <gloops> what seems to be the problem mk0
[13:44:58] <mk0> is it possible to use http://www.linuxcnc.org for work? not for simulation
[13:45:37] <mk0> dropbox says wheezy is not supported anymore. i use dropbox a lot
[13:46:00] <fragalot> it can be used to install a permanent version
[13:46:22] <fragalot> if you use that to run your machine, you will always have to either mount your real harddisk manually, or re-configure your machine each time you start up the livecd
[13:46:38] <gloops> yes, i dont think you can run the machine from the usb install though
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[13:47:13] <mk0> ah, no. i mean i install stretch and use it for work
[13:47:36] <gloops> i havent done it yet but yes i think sp
[13:47:58] <mk0> it's not an official version. but can it be used for work?
[13:48:07] <mk0> thanks
[13:48:08] <mk0> !
[13:48:42] <gloops> jthornton Tom_L
[13:49:01] <skunkworks> mk0: yes - it seems to be very stable. It is running rt_preempt so if you are planning on doing software step-generation - you may be limited
[13:56:44] <mk0> thanks!
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[14:04:29] <JT-Shop> gloops: he is at work :)
[14:04:43] <CaptHindsight> maybe I should write up a few clarifying remarks about preempt_rt, LPT port stepping and LPT PCI/e adapters
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[14:06:27] <CaptHindsight> All PCI/e LPT cards work for software stepping with RTAI if the mainboard and CPU have low enough latency (most often limited by a bad BIOS)
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[14:08:59] <CaptHindsight> the PCI/e LPT cards that you have to watch out for are those that have broken EPP. This is only a problem if you are using a LPT to Mesa 7i43
[14:09:39] <gloops> JT-Shop its ok the question got answered thanks
[14:12:50] <CaptHindsight> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org this card just needs a kernel patch
[14:13:37] <CaptHindsight> are there any PCI/e LPT cards that don't work well with software stepping right to a BOB?
[14:14:54] <Tom_L> JT-Shop, i am?
[14:15:16] <Tom_L> don't tell the boss otherwise...
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[14:21:48] * JT-Shop was talking about himself :)
[14:27:16] <roycroft> i'm looking for parts bins, similar to the allit or tanos
[14:27:17] <roycroft> http://www.leevalley.com
[14:27:26] <roycroft> that's an example of the allit bins
[14:27:34] <roycroft> does anyone have a source for such things at a good price?
[14:28:07] <roycroft> i need ~1500 of them, and i don't want to pay $1+ each
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[14:28:34] <Tom_L> uline.com probably has them
[14:29:02] * roycroft needs to consolidate the wall 'o' fasteners into a more compact form factor, so he can use the wall for other things
[14:29:06] <roycroft> i didn't find htem on uline
[14:29:31] <roycroft> plastic parts bins tend to be those long bins with angled, pen fronts
[14:29:42] <roycroft> they're intended to either stack freestanding, or hang on walls/racks
[14:29:49] <roycroft> what i need are drawer inserts
[14:30:12] <roycroft> i can buy tanos inserts similar to those allit ones
[14:30:19] <SpeedEvil> roycroft: bags can work.
[14:30:22] <roycroft> the 60mm square tanos are 6.75 euros each
[14:30:30] <roycroft> plus shipping from germany
[14:30:39] <roycroft> no, bags really really cannot work
[14:30:49] <SpeedEvil> roycroft: thicker bags, perhaps with cards, in a drawer, for smaller parts at least if they are not sharp.
[14:30:55] <roycroft> not when one has thousands of fasteners in stock
[14:31:40] <roycroft> i have a wall full of these right now:
[14:31:42] <roycroft> https://www.amazon.com
[14:31:58] <roycroft> 12 of them in total, with either one or two dividers in each drawer
[14:32:09] <roycroft> and they're almost completely full
[14:32:36] <SpeedEvil> Are most of them one or two fastners each, or actually appreciably filled?
[14:32:41] <roycroft> i really need 3000 inserts, if i move everything to individual bins, but i'll probably have to do half at a time due to cost and time constraints
[14:32:54] <roycroft> i try to keep them appreciably filled, for the most part
[14:32:58] <SpeedEvil> Ah.
[14:33:05] <roycroft> i actually have a color coding system with little self-adhesive dots
[14:33:19] <roycroft> when something is fully stocked (usually quantity 100) there's a green dot
[14:33:25] <roycroft> when i'm running low, a yellow dot
[14:33:28] <roycroft> and when i'm out, a red dot
[14:33:35] <roycroft> i try to avoid red dots and minimise yellow dots
[14:33:44] <SpeedEvil> I've wondered about just taking 2mm sheet, and making up a lot of wooden drawers with inserts.
[14:33:48] <SpeedEvil> 2mm polycarbonate
[14:34:06] <roycroft> if i can't find a good price on the inserts i'll make them out of 8mm baltic birch plywood
[14:34:22] <roycroft> but that's a lot of work, and the walls will be way thicker than i want, wasting a lot of space
[14:34:40] <roycroft> i don't relish the idea of fabricating thousands of tiny bins out of plywood
[14:34:57] <roycroft> but that's the price point i need to pursue
[14:35:06] <Tom_L> grab a bunch of electrical boxes :)
[14:35:36] <SpeedEvil> https://www.ebay.co.uk
[14:35:38] <roycroft> and a napkin calculation tells me i can make them for <$0.50 each for 60mm square bins, counting only cost of the plywood
[14:35:42] <SpeedEvil> This class of thing can be interesting
[14:35:47] <roycroft> not counting the cost of the glue, nor my time
[14:36:20] * roycroft wonders how many router bits he would burn up making box joints for 3000 bins
[14:36:41] <CaptHindsight> I got rid of my small cabinets with those little plastic drawers decades ago.
[14:37:13] <roycroft> the wall 'o' fasteners worked well for me for 20 or so years
[14:37:24] <roycroft> but my shop is just too small to afford that kind of space
[14:37:26] <CaptHindsight> my collections would always outgrow them and i was spending more time reorganizing
[14:37:30] <Tom_L> http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81 :)
[14:37:35] <Tom_L> i get those from time to time
[14:37:49] <SpeedEvil> https://www.tesco.com
[14:37:51] <roycroft> i should be able to fit all the fasteners in one small cabinet that sits on the floor, about 1/4 the width of the wall 'o' fasteners
[14:37:54] <CaptHindsight> getting a bigger shop worked for me :)
[14:38:03] <SpeedEvil> I've found useful, but it would be nice to source them in bulk.
[14:38:17] <SpeedEvil> They fit really nicely in 15cm deep 40*60cm trays
[14:38:30] <SpeedEvil> that I got from a vendor that sold ex-supermarket delivery trays.
[14:38:34] <roycroft> getting a bigger shop is what i really need to do, but i can't build anything bigger on my property
[14:38:42] <CaptHindsight> the clear plastic container work out pretty well
[14:38:43] <roycroft> i've considered going up, but that would be way expensive
[14:39:01] <SpeedEvil> https://www.ebay.co.uk
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[14:40:01] <roycroft> i've written lee valley asking if they will offer a better discount for quantity 1000+
[14:40:09] <roycroft> they're pretty good about that kind of stuff
[14:40:15] <roycroft> so they may come in with a good price
[14:40:27] <roycroft> if i get the 60mm square ones for $0.60 or so, i'd be happy
[14:45:04] <roycroft> i do wonder why the only insert bins like that which i've found are made in germany, and why they're virtually unavailable in north america
[14:45:19] <roycroft> do people over here not like to organize their stuff?
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[14:45:56] <roycroft> one should be able to get bins like that at harbor freight for $0.10 or so each
[14:46:25] <roycroft> the only problem being that one would have to let them offgas in the driveway for a half a year before being able to bring them into the shop
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[14:59:13] <MrHindsight> just try to find a brand that keeps the same size bottom and lids over time
[15:01:39] <Rab> roycroft, I'd be interested in an economical source as well. I have some big metal card file cabinets I use for fasteners and mill tooling, but no real method of organization within the trays...IIRC they're about 4-1/2" wide.
[15:01:51] <roycroft> maybe it's time to invest in a 3d printer
[15:02:00] <roycroft> i could probably print what? maybe 5 bins/day?
[15:02:14] <roycroft> that would only take two years or so to make enough :)
[15:02:20] <MrHindsight> i like the paper ice cream container route
[15:02:38] <MrHindsight> paerboard
[15:02:45] <MrHindsight> paperboard
[15:02:46] <Rab> roycroft, for the filament cost you could buy any injection-molded bins you want.
[15:02:58] <MrHindsight> http://www2.us.huhtamaki.com
[15:03:02] <roycroft> so what's nice about using the standardized bins like tanos or allit is that i can get a nice case for them
[15:03:30] <roycroft> so when i am out on a job site, or even working on a project elsewhere in the shop, i could pull the bins i need for the job, put them in the case, and safely and neatly transport them
[15:03:48] <roycroft> the allit cases are $90, which is pretty expensive, but i would only ever need one, i should think
[15:04:16] <roycroft> sortimo would be another vendor i'd look at, except again, it's impossible to find the individual bins in north america
[15:04:27] <roycroft> i can buy a sortimo case full of bins any day of the week
[15:04:35] <roycroft> but i don't want their cases
[15:04:38] <roycroft> just the bins
[15:04:54] <roycroft> i kind of wonder if i should get into the business of selling those bins
[15:04:56] <gloops> i got about 40 rigid plastic trays from the local school, drawers for the kids stuff, they throw them out when they get tatty and just put new trays in
[15:05:19] <MrHindsight> http://ww.interpresstechnologies.com space saving, and cheap
[15:05:20] <roycroft> i'd just need to get a container of bins from germany
[15:05:51] <gregcnc> maybe http://www.schallercorporation.com
[15:07:26] <MrHindsight> https://www.harborfreight.com
[15:07:53] <MrHindsight> https://www.harborfreight.com
[15:08:05] <roycroft> yeah, that doesn't work for me
[15:08:07] <roycroft> i have heaps of those
[15:08:11] <MrHindsight> nesting clear plastic bins
[15:08:18] <roycroft> but for the general hardware inventory i really need individual bins
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[15:09:42] <MrHindsight> I've had the local Fastenal offer to stop by and keep tradck of my part inventory :)
[15:10:28] <MrHindsight> i have a hard time declining their gracious offer without laughing
[15:10:58] <roycroft> i do have at least 2000 line items in my fastener inventory
[15:11:16] <MrHindsight> "and will they also tell me what to buy?"
[15:11:17] <roycroft> but i still end up making a truck roll for the occasional odd fastener
[15:11:36] <roycroft> my goal is to mostly eliminate those truck rolls, and i've been pretty successful at that over the years
[15:11:49] <roycroft> if i need 2 of a fastener i don't have i'll usually buy 100
[15:12:09] <Rab> MrHindsight, Fastenal's expensive, limited and rarely-stocked inventory will tell you exactly what you can buy.
[15:12:12] <roycroft> for jobs that require a quantity of fasteners i buy for that job, of course
[15:12:24] <roycroft> but for onesies/twosies it's nice having inventory
[15:12:26] <gloops> you have to be careful with the stacking tubs, a lot on offer now are sheer rubbish, thin walled brittle crap that doesnt last 5 minutes
[15:12:27] <roycroft> it saves a lot of time
[15:12:27] <MrHindsight> "Management, do you have a hard time deciding what to spend your budget on? Inventory, workers, gambling? ... well have we got a system worked out for you!!
[15:12:38] <roycroft> my color coding system works well for me
[15:13:04] <roycroft> i use these:
[15:13:06] <roycroft> https://www.staples.com
[15:13:32] <roycroft> i even use the blue ones sometimes - those are for items that i have in stock but do not want to restock
[15:13:59] <MrHindsight> Rab: the only good thing about fastenal for me is that the big warehouse is overnight for me, so >90% is next day
[15:14:20] <Rab> I'd put McMaster-Carr in charge of it; I placed an order on Thursday and it arrived Friday with ground shipping...they seem to be getting faster at pulling and shipping.
[15:14:26] <MrHindsight> guess it's ~100 miles north
[15:14:45] <MrHindsight> McMaster is a 1 hour drive for me
[15:14:57] <MrHindsight> or next day by UPS
[15:15:10] <Rab> MrHindsight, most excellent. Are you near the GA warehouse?
[15:15:22] <MrHindsight> they tried an afterhour will call near Chicago
[15:15:28] <MrHindsight> ^^
[15:15:35] <Rab> ahh
[15:16:24] <MrHindsight> Grainer has a $1/box overstock I look for
[15:16:55] <MrHindsight> fasteners next day and I pickup 40 minutes away, no shipping fee
[15:19:11] <MrHindsight> https://www.grainger.com
[15:19:33] <roycroft> mcmaster are usually a day from me via ups
[15:19:47] <roycroft> 2 days typically in the winter, when there is snow in the passes
[15:20:02] <roycroft> but i get most of my fasteners from eugene fastener, who are 5 minutes from my house
[15:20:13] <roycroft> they have about a quarter million line items in stock
[15:20:22] <MrHindsight> nice
[15:20:37] <roycroft> it's unusual when they don't have what i want, unless i'm looking for something really weird
[15:21:03] <MrHindsight> eugene fastener, sounds like an explorer
[15:25:06] <Rab> We used to have a decent local fastener place, until they were bought out by FastServ which seems to be a Fastenal clone. Don't let it happen to yours!
[15:27:38] <MrHindsight> around here there are several and they are competitive, they even deliver
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[15:31:18] <MrHindsight> other than raw materials (steel, aluminum etc) has anyone been effected by the latest Chinese tariffs?
[15:32:47] <roycroft> i haven't bought anything from grizzly in a while, but they've definitely tacked the tariff on their products
[15:33:01] <roycroft> i'd like to get a new edge sander, and there is no tariff charge on it yet
[15:33:04] <t0ner> the cost of shipping is going to rise, as well
[15:33:09] <roycroft> grizzly are adding the tariff as they get new products in
[15:33:15] <roycroft> current inventory is not subject to it
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[15:33:40] <roycroft> so i should probably think about getting that sander soon, before they run out of stock and the price goes up 25%
[15:33:56] <laminae_> Good day gents
[15:33:59] <roycroft> that would reqire a wad of cash and selling my old one though
[15:34:16] <laminae_> So i had three parker linear actuators land in my lap, all 16" travel
[15:34:46] <laminae_> And i'm converting my cnc router rig to use them instead of the leadscrew driven polycarbonate wheel nonsense
[15:35:02] <laminae_> And i'm not in the market for a big boy spindle to go with the set
[15:36:23] <laminae_> The bulk of my cutting is actually plastics and mdf for vacuum forming bucks, but i do a fair bit of cf (with a flood bed) and i would like to do aluminum now that i will have "rigid" actuators
[15:37:21] <laminae_> Due to arcing hazard from a stray piece of cf i'd like water cooled and preferably lass than 1000 bucks and 110v 2hpish
[15:37:31] <laminae_> Any suggestions?
[15:38:18] <laminae_> Worth noting, i am currently using a piece of junk ebay vfd that "works" and i'd like something better than that low bar
[15:38:47] <MrHindsight> laminae_: what range of RPM?
[15:39:49] <laminae_> Higher is much better for cf, i have almost no experience with alum so i really don't know what my needs would be there i'd say high end 20kish?
[15:40:23] <laminae_> Plastics tend to melt with too high rpm, but if it came down to it i have other options for those
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[15:41:13] <laminae_> i think i'm in the ball park of 1200 rpm for most of the plastics
[15:42:12] <laminae_> Any thought son this? https://www.rockler.com
[15:42:54] <laminae_> I wish there were bearing specs
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[15:43:23] <MrHindsight> https://www.automationtechnologiesinc.com
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[15:45:07] <laminae_> only 6k rpm on that puppy
[15:45:18] <Rab> laminae_, are you in the US?
[15:45:24] <laminae_> Yes
[15:45:37] <MrHindsight> oh so you want the higher rpms?
[15:46:02] <laminae_> yeah, at least 18k for cf
[15:46:17] <Rab> Seems like Rockler is charging quite a premium for their 12mo warranty: https://www.amazon.com
[15:46:25] <gregcnc> you can get basically the same thing on ebay for half http://a.co
[15:46:38] <gregcnc> yeah
[15:46:47] <MrHindsight> https://www.automationtechnologiesinc.com
[15:47:03] <MrHindsight> ER-20
[15:47:06] <Rab> That listing seems to be domestic, so you could replace a defective unit...much harder when the product ships from China.
[15:47:29] <gregcnc> And that's what your paying for
[15:47:33] <MrHindsight> https://www.automationtechnologiesinc.com just outside Chicago
[15:47:46] <MrHindsight> the guy that owns it is ok
[15:47:51] <MrHindsight> pretty fair
[15:48:02] <MrHindsight> just doesn't get Linux though
[15:48:15] <laminae_> I have one sub par spindle from ebay already, this one is a bit on the spendy side but worth looking through specs
[15:48:25] <MrHindsight> has a PhD from the U of I in ME
[15:49:12] <MrHindsight> I should ask him what he did his thesis on
[15:50:10] <Rab> laminae_, are you limited to 110V?
[15:50:23] <laminae_> Yes
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[15:57:34] <gloops> laminae_ get one of the 0-24k hy spindle/vfd sets
[15:57:42] <gloops> £150
[15:58:35] <laminae_> That's what i currently have
[15:58:51] <laminae_> There is deflection under very little load
[15:59:07] <laminae_> Bad oscillations, particularly at high rpm
[15:59:44] <gregcnc> But is that a spindle issue or machine issue?
[16:00:44] <gloops> surely the spindle doesnt bend
[16:01:25] <laminae_> no, it does not bend
[16:01:32] <gregcnc> of course it does, but it should not be enough to cause trouble within the expected operating range
[16:01:51] <laminae_> I'm assuming whatever collet fits to the bearings does not have a tight enough tolerance
[16:02:02] <laminae_> or perhaps just low tolerance bearings
[16:03:09] <gloops> theyre not brilliant but usually adequate for wood and light ally work
[16:03:28] <laminae_> My top priotority here is cf and aluminum
[16:03:37] <laminae_> WHich is why i'm looking to upgrade
[16:03:51] <laminae_> Gotta run for the moment though, be back in a bit
[16:03:53] <gloops> any pics of the machine?
[16:04:35] <laminae_> Been upgraded a fair bit since this, but here https://imgur.com
[16:05:29] <laminae_> Be back in an hour
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[16:06:33] <gloops> think the rollers might be contribution to the 'deflection' problem
[16:08:18] -!- P1ersson has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
[16:08:45] <Rab> gloops, and not the legendary rigidity of extruded aluminum?
[16:10:33] <gloops> nah they make lifts with that stuff
[16:11:27] <Rab> I think laminae_ is on the right track with the linear actuator upgrade. The base machine might not be able to support it though.
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[16:12:23] <gloops> well he could brace the cross beam up, throw that z away and get some plates, working with narrow footprint for linear rails though
[16:12:58] <gloops> either way i think theres likely to be far more slack in the z as it is, than in the spindle bearings
[16:13:00] <gregcnc> did you just use many words to say build a better machine?
[16:14:23] <gloops> wells hes going to spend $1000 on a spindle that wont change anything
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[16:55:10] <Deejay> gn8
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[17:01:17] <laminae_> Is modbus the preferred standard for vfd control?
[17:06:54] <cpresser> there is no such thing as prefered. its a valid method amonst others
[17:09:35] <laminae_> Thanks
[17:09:41] <roycroft> i use my forefinger and sometimes my thumb for vfd control
[17:09:49] <roycroft> that is what i currently prefer
[17:09:58] <cpresser> what does you vfd offer, and what are your available outputs?
[17:10:05] <roycroft> if i'm honest, though, i've never tried using my toes
[17:12:20] <laminae_> I have an hy right now, currently opperated by traditional index finger
[17:14:50] <laminae_> This is certainly appealing to me, who was it that suggested https://www.automationtechnologiesinc.com
[17:15:15] <laminae_> Wondering if anyone has direct experience with the product
[17:15:55] <laminae_> er20, 110v and water cooling being very appealing in addition to rpm range
[17:16:11] <roycroft> you can get 80mm spindles on ebay for half that price
[17:16:17] <roycroft> i don't know what the difference in quality is
[17:16:37] <roycroft> although the spindle won't come with a bracket for $250
[17:17:05] <roycroft> it would be worth looking at the $250 ones though, i think
[17:17:14] <roycroft> to see if they are comparable in quality
[17:17:23] <roycroft> you can buy a lot of beer with $250 in your pocket
[17:17:25] <laminae_> I'm just afriad of getting another piece of crap like i already have x.x
[17:18:32] <laminae_> Also, roy, not sure if you remember me but you were a ton of help setting up my machine and i really appreciate it
[17:18:39] <Rab> I wouldn't buy anything that doesn't ship from within the US.
[17:18:47] <roycroft> they're easy to repair
[17:18:49] <roycroft> https://www.youtube.com
[17:19:03] <roycroft> as that factory authorized service center demonstrates :)
[17:19:14] <roycroft> i do remember you, laminae
[17:19:47] <laminae_> Hopefully not too painful haha
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[17:20:57] <laminae_> I think you cautioned me on the quality of my linear actuators and your words have certainly been true
[17:21:33] <laminae_> I had a trio of 16" parker ballscrew stages fall into my lap and i'm retrofitting them into that frame
[17:22:46] <roycroft> god, i need to avoid teh youtube until after the election
[17:22:58] <roycroft> every single video has a politcal commercial at the beginning that i can't skip
[17:23:21] <roycroft> and it's all lies
[17:23:23] <roycroft> both sides lie
[17:23:27] <roycroft> both sides shout
[17:23:30] <roycroft> both sides are nasty
[17:23:45] <laminae_> Can't we all peddle hate in peace?
[17:23:55] <roycroft> i need to form a new political party called the be nice, be honest party
[17:24:28] <laminae_> Take a peek at these bad boys https://imgur.com
[17:24:53] <laminae_> I don't have a use for the small stages really, but i'n thinking a laser cutter with the motors
[17:27:05] <Rab> laminae_, stack them for greater travel!
[17:27:17] <Rab> Nice warez by the way.
[17:27:58] <laminae_> Looking at the specs the little guys aren't rated for machining and i think i'd eat my cost in drivers pretty quick
[17:28:09] <laminae_> I got super lucky on the whole
[17:28:20] <laminae_> everything pictured for 600 bucks
[17:31:42] <laminae_> gotta run
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[17:55:30] <roycroft> joy - i just found some storage bins for a lot less than those ones from lee valley
[17:55:44] <roycroft> http://www.schallercorporation.com
[17:55:49] <roycroft> as in less than half the cost
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[17:56:52] <SpeedEvil> yay
[17:57:15] <roycroft> more like 1/3 the cost, actually
[17:57:24] <roycroft> getting down to where they are affordable
[17:57:25] <SpeedEvil> If the plastic isn't brittle crap and the drawers don't fit, that is.
[17:57:35] <roycroft> http://www.schallercorporation.com
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[17:57:38] <Rab> <gregcnc> maybe http://www.schallercorporation.com
[17:57:45] <roycroft> the equivalent of those are $1.20 at lee valley
[17:57:56] <roycroft> i didn't see his post
[17:58:13] <roycroft> i'll happily give him credit though :)
[17:58:22] <roycroft> and wish i had seen it however long ago it was
[17:58:26] <syyl> oh
[17:59:17] <syyl> schaller bins. all thats needed to get "lean"
[18:00:17] <roycroft> they will fit the drawers
[18:00:25] <roycroft> because i'm not making the drawers until i have the inserts
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[18:23:58] <CaptHindsight> whats heavier a pound of sand or a pound of wet sand?
[18:25:37] <MarcelineVQ> That's a heavy question my dude
[18:26:04] <Rab> Wet sand will evaporate moisture during any time it takes to measure the weight, so it'll obviously come up lighter.
[18:26:55] <Tom_L> a pound of feathers
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[18:27:25] <Rab> Even if the chickens are flying?
[18:27:35] <Tom_L> especially
[18:28:38] <CaptHindsight> oh the sand is in a bag so moisture can't escape
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[18:29:37] <CaptHindsight> https://www.simetric.co.uk
[18:29:42] <Rab> Then you have to add the weight of the bag!
[18:29:50] <CaptHindsight> wet sand vs compacted dry sand
[18:30:22] <CaptHindsight> vs wet compacted sand
[18:31:05] <CaptHindsight> very very very compacted sand is sandstone
[18:34:16] <Tom_L> depends on the wetting agent
[18:48:04] <CaptHindsight> https://www.materials.sandvik
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[18:52:14] <jthornton> looks like I can use #2 copper to go from the new panel to the house panel...
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[19:04:42] <Xnke> what's happenin in folks
[19:04:56] <CaptHindsight> if you had a scale inside a bag of sand would it measure the weight of the bag? If not all the bag then how much?
[19:05:29] <roycroft> pretty heavy conversation here
[19:10:50] <CaptHindsight> https://www.youtube.com Gas Atomization of Stainless Steel - Slow Motion
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[19:17:05] <Xnke> the scale would measure the acceleration due to gravity. not the bag.
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[19:30:37] <CaptHindsight> if you place a steel rod on on a scale and it weighs 1Kg, if you lean the top end of the bar against so it partially rests on the wall next to the scale how much will the scale register when the bar is tipped at 30, 45 and 60 deg
[19:32:50] <CaptHindsight> from vertical
[19:42:25] <Xnke> do you want results including friction or theoretical results?
[19:50:04] <CaptHindsight> only results involving irrational number
[19:50:19] <CaptHindsight> s
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[19:53:52] <_unreal_> yay an other one of my important parts showed up finally
[19:54:02] <_unreal_> just got in my special usb hub
[19:54:16] <_unreal_> micro board usb hub
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[21:24:16] <infornography> Wild Berry skittles > normal skittles
[21:26:07] <MarcelineVQ> tropical too
[21:26:50] <MarcelineVQ> even sour are pretty good, if you don't like your teeth
[21:27:51] <infornography> teeth are evil, need to be punished
[21:28:04] <MarcelineVQ> You at least have to keep them on their toes
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[21:50:21] <flyback> <Tom_L> flyback, hedge wood has also been used for bearings in some things
[21:50:26] <flyback> cool
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[22:00:01] <ziper> is 500 bucks enough to build a modestly sized 3 axis table capable of cutting foam
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[22:03:15] <pink_vampire> ziper: yeah
[22:03:37] <pink_vampire> you can make something very easy with belts
[22:04:22] <ziper> less dense woods too or is that too much? do belts have any problems with long travels?
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[22:05:22] <pink_vampire> you need good tension on the belts
[22:08:19] <ziper> coreXY the best setup?
[22:10:25] <pink_vampire> ziper: if you are going to make foam cutter, i think it is better to make it as dual XY, (4 axis)
[22:13:54] <ziper> I don't follow. what do the 3rd and 4th axes do?
[22:15:18] <pink_vampire> it give you the ability to cut tapered shape
[22:18:31] <ziper> do you have an example, i'm sorry, i'm not seeing it
[22:19:51] <pink_vampire> https://www.instructables.com
[22:21:37] <_unreal_> ziper, hi
[22:21:40] <_unreal_> long time no see
[22:22:01] <_unreal_> you had some question for me but I never saw you again till now
[22:22:44] <ziper> pink_vampire, oh, I don't want hot wire, I want a spindle, I don't think my foam takes to hot wire cutting
[22:23:18] <_unreal_> ziper, if your talking about closed cell foam for fiberglass layup your right
[22:23:23] <CaptHindsight> hahaha that is 2 axis with 4 joints!!
[22:23:38] <_unreal_> hot wire is useless
[22:24:01] <CaptHindsight> hot grits cutter
[22:24:42] <_unreal_> grits?
[22:25:11] <CaptHindsight> https://en.wikipedia.org
[22:25:31] <_unreal_> ziper, ?
[22:25:46] <ziper> _unreal_, what
[22:26:08] <_unreal_> what? I just asked you a few questions
[22:26:58] <ziper> i dont know anything about grits
[22:27:22] <ziper> https://www.youtube.com
[22:27:54] <CaptHindsight> ziper: that's my favorite grits scene
[22:28:26] <pink_vampire> ziper: oh, so you need very fast spindle, the load on it will be close to 0
[22:29:06] <pink_vampire> i have foam project that i want to do
[22:29:33] <_unreal_> ziper, did you ever figure out the answer to the question you asked me a week ago or so ?
[22:29:37] <_unreal_> I dont recall what it was
[22:29:48] <ziper> _unreal_, neither do i, lol
[22:30:04] <_unreal_> foam question maybe?
[22:30:15] <_unreal_> or structure
[22:30:16] <ziper> well I guess one question is can you make an acceptable mold by vac bagging one layer of glass to a female carved from foam
[22:30:32] <_unreal_> yes
[22:30:37] <_unreal_> with a catch
[22:30:47] <_unreal_> What weight is the glass
[22:30:52] <pink_vampire> ziper: what travel do you need?
[22:31:01] <_unreal_> and you need peelply and breather cloth
[22:31:32] <ziper> pink_vampire, i was hoping for like 2ft x 4ft x 10inches
[22:31:55] <CaptHindsight> I heard that if you vacuum foam it no longer is foam
[22:32:12] <CaptHindsight> well in a bag anyway
[22:32:12] <pink_vampire> what accuracy?
[22:32:19] <_unreal_> ziper, https://www.fibreglast.com
[22:32:45] <_unreal_> CaptHindsight, depends on what kind of foam your talking about
[22:33:03] <ziper> does the smooth peel ply actually work? ive only used the rough stuff
[22:33:16] <CaptHindsight> polyester or polyether foam
[22:33:19] <_unreal_> rough? peel ply?
[22:33:34] <ziper> pink_vampire, I don't know how to properly quantify it, but relatively accurate
[22:33:34] <CaptHindsight> open cell
[22:34:02] <ziper> CaptHindsight, PVC, closed cell
[22:34:02] <_unreal_> polyester foam will expand, eurothain foam will not
[22:34:45] <_unreal_> ziper, I've never heard of rough peelply?
[22:35:01] <_unreal_> there are a few types of peelply but the most common are these. one sec getting a link
[22:35:11] <ziper> I think this one https://www.fibreglast.com
[22:35:30] <_unreal_> https://www.fibreglast.com
[22:35:54] <_unreal_> https://www.alibaba.com
[22:36:38] <CaptHindsight> closed cell foam will expand under lower pressures
[22:36:39] <_unreal_> its more or less like the stuff I just posted....
[22:36:53] <_unreal_> CaptHindsight, TOTAL BULL SHIT
[22:37:03] <CaptHindsight> no
[22:37:08] <_unreal_> closed cell foam is used in vacuum infusion
[22:37:19] <ziper> it obviously depends on the foam
[22:37:24] <_unreal_> CaptHindsight, I am a master glass man working on boats and that WHAT I do you are full of shit
[22:37:40] <ziper> also consider that when its sandwiched it still under pressure from the vac bag
[22:37:44] <CaptHindsight> closed cells are like balloons
[22:37:52] <_unreal_> CaptHindsight, thats opencell
[22:38:06] <_unreal_> and not eurothain based
[22:38:13] <CaptHindsight> open cells are like not balloons
[22:38:20] <ziper> its not like its in a rigid vac chamber, its in a bag
[22:38:27] <_unreal_> now your contradicting your self
[22:38:42] <_unreal_> CaptHindsight, you have no idea what your talking about
[22:39:27] <CaptHindsight> I'm sorry I can only have this discussion with someone with English as a first language
[22:39:58] <_unreal_> right....
[22:40:05] <_unreal_> sight a link prooving your point
[22:41:07] <_unreal_> CaptHindsight, I generate about $30k USD per month for the company I work for per month just in my own chargable work hours....
[22:41:25] <_unreal_> and that is doing all kinds of work on boats everything from FRP to hardware and tech... work.
[22:41:33] <CaptHindsight> oh I'm just a polymer chemist
[22:41:58] <_unreal_> I asked for links prooving your point
[22:42:00] <_unreal_> any tiem
[22:42:01] <_unreal_> time
[22:42:26] <ziper> CaptHindsight, when spraying polyester resin (gelcoat) is it better to thin with styrene or acetone? or something else?
[22:42:34] <_unreal_> I also spent years working for the Jackson lab www.jax.org I am also publish with them. after I did a project on the SJL mouse
[22:42:39] <_unreal_> trust me I can go on and on
[22:42:54] <_unreal_> ziper, depends
[22:43:19] <_unreal_> and you dont really want to use styrene, its better to use... ahh
[22:43:22] <_unreal_> crap whats it called
[22:43:32] <_unreal_> brain fart
[22:43:55] <ziper> peeps are made from closed cell foam https://youtu.be
[22:43:56] <_unreal_> https://www.fibreglast.com
[22:44:06] <_unreal_> Duratec
[22:45:11] <ziper> duratec isn't the same, its for anti-orange peel, and causes chalk after a while. I'm talking about just for thinning
[22:45:45] <_unreal_> ALL gelcoat will chaulk
[22:45:53] <_unreal_> the thinner makes little difference
[22:46:06] <CaptHindsight> ziper: I like to add styrene since it's a carcinogen and people don't like the odor
[22:46:21] <_unreal_> gel will chalk about a few 32nd per year in the sun especially in the south like where I am in florida
[22:46:40] <CaptHindsight> styrene is an active solvent vs the acetone, so what do you want to do?
[22:47:03] <_unreal_> What are you spraying
[22:47:21] <ziper> CaptHindsight, I want to maintain the properties of the gelcoat
[22:47:25] <ziper> I like the smell
[22:47:46] <_unreal_> ziper, then you need a cup gun
[22:47:50] <ziper> the question is if the acetone will evaporate causing weakness
[22:48:01] <ziper> or if the extra styrene will still crosslink
[22:48:12] <_unreal_> https://fiberglasssource.com
[22:49:28] <_unreal_> ziper, generally people use duritec or acetone to thin.. and thinning is only for using spray guns with small opening for fan/mist style spray
[22:49:54] <_unreal_> a cup gun you dont need to thin PERIOD
[22:49:57] <CaptHindsight> styrene much lower vapor pressure than the acetone
[22:49:57] <ziper> I drilled my HVLP out and it still needed a little thinner
[22:50:16] <_unreal_> ziper, get a cup gun like in the link
[22:50:24] <_unreal_> there are different tip diam as well
[22:50:31] <CaptHindsight> the acetone won't crosslink
[22:50:49] <_unreal_> all you do is use a paper cut. mix put it on the gun spray... toss the empty cup and wipe the tip with acetone to clean. DONE
[22:51:04] <CaptHindsight> the styrene can crosslink
[22:51:08] <_unreal_> CaptHindsight, crosslinking is the auction between the gelcoat and MEKP
[22:51:12] <_unreal_> wtf ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT
[22:51:36] <ziper> styrene participates
[22:51:42] <CaptHindsight> Marisa Tomei
[22:51:48] <ziper> so hot
[22:51:56] <CaptHindsight> you shouldn't of posted that video
[22:51:58] <_unreal_> acetone evaporates almost immediately when spraying or rather when atomized by a spray gun...
[22:52:42] <_unreal_> again your full of it
[22:53:01] <CaptHindsight> sorry there appears to be a language barrier
[22:53:05] <ziper> why does a thermoset resin such as polyester even need the MEKP, why can't you just straight heat it?
[22:53:34] <CaptHindsight> unsaturated polyester or saturated?
[22:53:56] <_unreal_> ziper, if you google gelcoat thinner your mainly going to get (patch booster) which is duratec
[22:54:22] <_unreal_> and suggestions to NOT use acetone and or styrene
[22:54:25] <CaptHindsight> Patch Booster sounds like a cowboy name
[22:54:39] <_unreal_> ziper, https://blog-fgci.com
[22:54:54] <ziper> un, i guess
[22:55:13] <_unreal_> ziper, also do you put your gelcoat though a paint strainer before you spray?
[22:55:25] <ziper> of course
[22:55:27] <_unreal_> good
[22:55:41] <ziper> I don't plan on doing any more gelcoat any time ever tbh
[22:56:01] <_unreal_> heh I just did a gel job yesterday
[22:56:05] <_unreal_> err today
[22:56:30] <_unreal_> making clam shells for a boat. they had plastic one's every one of them was messed up cracked broken
[22:56:43] <_unreal_> I made a mold off of one of them
[22:56:50] <_unreal_> and have made several so far
[22:56:52] <_unreal_> almost done
[23:01:27] <ziper> pink_vampire, can i still use belts with a spindle?
[23:01:50] <_unreal_> ?
[23:02:25] <_unreal_> heh... what kind of belt and spindle, and my short answer is yes
[23:03:39] <ziper> the kind to cnc cut foam cores and molds
[23:03:56] <Tom_L> as long as they are rated for the spindle rpm
[23:04:56] <_unreal_> all frp foams mil nice
[23:05:02] <_unreal_> though high RPM is suggested
[23:07:18] -!- infornography has joined #linuxcnc
[23:10:31] <ziper> can you just butt up linear rails instead of paying for longer ones?
[23:19:01] <infornography> It seems like that would cost more *thonk*
[23:19:24] <ziper> shipping
[23:37:45] <pink_vampire> ziper: belts = fast feed rate and low load, so as far as i think, belts will be easy solution, but of course the trade off will bee some accuracy because the nature of the belts
[23:41:26] <pink_vampire> be*