#linuxcnc | Logs for 2020-03-30
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[03:11:16] <Deejay> moin
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[03:42:17] <Loetmichel> mornin'
[03:42:27] <XXCoder> hey
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[04:40:29] <pink_vampire> hi
[04:40:37] <XXCoder> to
[04:40:40] <XXCoder> *yo
[04:45:35] <pink_vampire> how is life?
[04:45:53] <XXCoder> boring.
[04:46:06] <XXCoder> i disassembled my laser diode and found alum chips
[04:46:16] <XXCoder> nozzle is bit of a mess
[04:46:30] <XXCoder> https://imgur.com
[04:48:11] <pink_vampire> the picture looks very blurry
[04:49:04] <pink_vampire> after cleaning it got back to life?
[04:51:47] <pink_vampire> XXCoder: ^?
[04:51:47] <XXCoder> nope
[04:51:57] <XXCoder> you can see some white object in nozzle itself
[04:52:07] <pink_vampire> not sure
[04:52:10] <XXCoder> its messing with light. also im pretty sure theres more chips inside
[04:53:06] <pink_vampire> if you power it without the nozzle, how the beam looks?
[04:54:46] <XXCoder> havent done that its not assembled now so hard to test now
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[05:39:18] <pink_vampire> mmm i see
[05:44:57] <XXCoder> its put away for week now
[05:45:27] <XXCoder> btw laserweb is pretty good controller for laser machine, but dont use it for cam for svg
[05:45:30] <XXCoder> it sucks lol
[05:45:48] <XXCoder> plugin in inkscapes makes it move much much smoother on curves
[06:07:07] <jthornton> morning
[06:07:48] <XXCoder> hey jt
[06:08:42] <XXCoder> jt check it out https://imgur.com
[06:09:00] <XXCoder> look at pretty nasty condition of diofe
[06:09:03] <XXCoder> diode
[06:09:15] <XXCoder> and it had alum chips bunch of em too (fine powder)
[06:09:22] <XXCoder> you can still see some
[06:10:11] <XXCoder> see the white thing in nozzle of diode? weird
[06:10:39] <pink_vampire> is that magic smoke particles??
[06:11:04] <XXCoder> nah alum chips, feels like its from slicing extrude for cooling
[06:11:12] <XXCoder> feels like powder
[06:11:23] <jthornton> what is it?
[06:11:36] <XXCoder> its laser diode
[06:11:37] <pink_vampire> jthornton: laser head
[06:11:43] <XXCoder> its what is under lens for focus
[06:11:52] <jthornton> ah
[06:13:06] <pink_vampire> maybe your laser is infected with the corona virus?
[06:13:35] <XXCoder> lol
[06:14:06] <pink_vampire> some lasers need ventilator (air assist)
[06:14:15] <XXCoder> it does have it.
[06:14:49] <XXCoder> 2w is simply too weak to need it, its used to keep diode cool
[06:15:43] <jthornton> is that the new one?
[06:16:03] <XXCoder> nah old one
[06:16:10] <pink_vampire> did you clean the optics?
[06:16:12] <XXCoder> it failed to cut cardboard after 100 passes
[06:16:20] <XXCoder> it used to be fine at 40 passes
[06:16:28] <XXCoder> its been getting worse
[06:16:31] <XXCoder> pink yeah
[06:17:15] <pink_vampire> "40 passes" LOL for cardboard LOLLLL
[06:17:26] <XXCoder> its 2w not 20w :)
[06:17:47] <XXCoder> though I wonder if that white thing was there whole time, making it lose power
[06:17:57] <pink_vampire> just use a knife
[06:18:09] <XXCoder> nah im leaving it as is. complained to seller
[06:18:22] <XXCoder> alum powder is NOT acceptable and likely cause of breakdown
[06:24:22] <pink_vampire> ok, if you have aluminum powder in it, all you need to add some iron oxide powder and then to power the laser to light the thermite mix
[06:24:35] <XXCoder> ohh nice lol
[06:24:51] <pink_vampire> it will generate alot of heat that will cut the cardboard
[06:25:02] <XXCoder> im getting 5.5w, if seller sends me 2w replacement, dunno what to do with that
[06:25:11] <XXCoder> though maybe its useful for cutting paper!
[06:26:05] <pink_vampire> I think scissors will be faster
[06:26:08] <XXCoder> jthornton: did you see laser firing test
[06:26:13] <XXCoder> pink not at all!
[06:26:33] <XXCoder> it'd be very hard to cut some shapes using scissors. and laser can cut 4 or 5 in single pass
[06:27:04] <jthornton> no
[06:27:09] <XXCoder> a second
[06:27:20] <XXCoder> https://youtu.be
[06:27:29] <XXCoder> note its going too fast to cut anything, its just to show light
[06:27:54] <XXCoder> watch carefully when it reaches black spot. its nice and tight focus
[06:30:27] <pink_vampire> https://philadelphia.craigslist.org
[06:31:01] <XXCoder> ... is that glass co2 laser just in head?
[06:31:05] <XXCoder> dang
[06:31:09] <XXCoder> no enclosure too
[06:31:10] <pink_vampire> metal
[06:31:26] <XXCoder> theres metal co2 laser?
[06:31:31] <pink_vampire> metal co2 laser tube - I think it is air cooled
[06:31:49] <pink_vampire> yes, all the good ones are metal, and air cooled
[06:31:56] <XXCoder> wow
[06:32:01] <XXCoder> very expensive I guess
[06:32:29] <XXCoder> i could put 30 of my machines on that table LOL
[06:32:34] <pink_vampire> https://synrad.com
[06:32:42] <pink_vampire> this is the tube that he use
[06:33:34] <XXCoder> 8 and 10w interestong
[06:33:35] <Loetmichel> XXCoder: an 80W watercooled co2 tube is about 30mm diamenter and a good 1200mm long... you DONT want to have that moving with the head.
[06:33:52] <Loetmichel> its usually behind/bleow the table and the head only moves a mirror
[06:33:58] <Loetmichel> below
[06:34:06] <XXCoder> loet yeah thats why that video really was odd
[06:34:07] <pink_vampire> Loetmichel: look at the link
[06:34:20] <Loetmichel> which?
[06:34:23] <XXCoder> ah higher wattages down page
[06:34:31] <pink_vampire> Loetmichel: https://philadelphia.craigslist.org
[06:34:49] <XXCoder> it has no price
[06:34:57] <XXCoder> which means I cant afford it ;)
[06:35:30] <Loetmichel> ah, 50W
[06:35:40] <Loetmichel> yes, you CAN do that. its impractical though
[06:35:45] <Loetmichel> as you can see on the pic
[06:36:15] <pink_vampire> XXCoder: it's about half a kidney for a new tube,
[06:36:42] <XXCoder> im not exactly up to date for kidney values
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[06:37:15] <Loetmichel> its easier to have the tube stationary on the back, have a mirror that will put the beam parallel to the gantry, have another mirror on the gantry side that puts the beam parallel to x, then have another mirror on the head that points it downwards and THEN have a focus lens that moves in Z
[06:37:26] <pink_vampire> https://photovaclaser.com
[06:38:21] <XXCoder> wow
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[06:38:39] <XXCoder> loet yeah dunno if I ever will go that big tho lol
[06:38:48] <XXCoder> i think I would max out at 20w diode
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[06:39:39] <Loetmichel> also its nice to have the workspace being a grind with a vacuum box below rather than a massive aluiminium plate
[06:39:49] <Loetmichel> for fumes extraction pourposes
[06:40:07] <Loetmichel> and better "lower side" cutting quality
[06:40:10] <XXCoder> makes sense
[06:40:19] <Loetmichel> s/grind/grid
[06:40:34] <XXCoder> if I go 20w I would be using cover AND goggles in entire time machine is enabled
[06:44:14] * Loetmichel rememberes the sign in the laser lab at university: "protect your remaining eye!"
[06:44:20] <Loetmichel> :-)
[06:44:24] <XXCoder> yep heh
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[07:58:32] <SpeedEvil> Bedflinger works too if you don't care about floor area
[08:20:45] <pink_vampire> any of you know about other temperature scales then those common ones? (Celsius, Fahrenheit, Kelvin, Rankine, Delisle, Newton, Réaumur, Rømer)?
[08:22:11] <jymmmm> pink_vampire: Yeah... DAMN, SOB, HOLY SHIT, and son of a mother phucking bitch that's hot!
[08:24:08] <pink_vampire> jymmmm: you make me laugh so hard right now LOLLLL!!!!!
[08:24:52] <jymmmm> pink_vampire: Hey, it's a real scale, oh and "I TOLD you it was hot (SMH)"
[08:26:07] <pink_vampire> I'm dying here LOLLLLL
[08:30:04] <miss0r> I know that scale. I would argue it is better known than most of the ones pink_vampire listed :)
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[08:43:40] * miss0r is looking at buying a factory new lathe. I am looking at a Shaoxing GH-1840ZX
[08:43:49] <miss0r> Yes yes... its chinese.. But its not made from chinesiu,
[08:43:53] <miss0r> chinesium*
[08:44:53] <miss0r> 1000mm turning length, 460mm diameter clearance over the ways. turn up to 700mm diameter if the well is removed. and last but absolutly not least: 80mm spindle bore
[08:45:25] <miss0r> https://www.okv.dk (should anyone be interrested)
[08:45:42] <miss0r> 2835kg worth of cast iron :]
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[09:25:05] <Loetmichel> hmm, after destroying 30 mill bits in 3 days... do you guys think that think here is useful? Original fogbuster is a bit out of bosses budget: https://www.ebay.de
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[09:30:10] <miss0r> Loetmichel: It will work, no doubt
[09:30:58] <Loetmichel> think so?
[09:31:07] <miss0r> The issue with most minimal spray coolant systems that are *not* fogbuster, is that they actualy make a coolant mist, which floats around everywhere, where the fogbuster ascualy throws small droplets at the work. It sorta minimizes the oil mist part
[09:31:48] <miss0r> So you are likely to end up with oil floating around in the air. But if you have some sort of fume ventilation system or the likes it should not be an issue
[09:41:03] <syyl> the issue with almost all mql systems, including the fogbuster: theyre shit.
[09:44:41] <Loetmichel> as i mill with a mix of water IPA and dish detergent: not THAT much of a problem if it gernates an aerosol
[09:44:54] <Loetmichel> @ miss0r
[09:45:41] <Loetmichel> also the machines are enclosed and have a vacuum table thats pulling a pretty big amount of air thru the shopvac that drives it
[09:45:48] <unterhaus> you use beer as a coolant?
[09:46:12] <Loetmichel> isoproply alcohol
[09:48:31] <Loetmichel> btw: are they CRAZY? just tried to restock on 99.9% IPA today... last time (last year) i paid $45 for 10 liters of the stuff... today they want $75 for a 5 liter jug?!?
[09:48:50] <Loetmichel> #scheiss corona
[09:49:59] <sensille> you could have seen this coming
[09:50:55] <Loetmichel> didn know we were low
[09:51:31] <Loetmichel> coworker just came by "IPA jugs in the storage are BOTH empty".... whoever puts empty jugs back into the rack .-(
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[09:52:01] <Loetmichel> now i have to bring my private stash of 10 liters to the company so we can work
[09:52:08] <Loetmichel> grmbl
[09:58:55] <unterhaus> I wonder if pinterest will ever notice I never open emails entitled "we think you might like these pins"
[10:02:39] <unterhaus> I have a coolant system, but I think using it in my basement would be a bad idea
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[10:35:54] <jymmmm> Loetmichel: SEriously, that's your bosses responsability, not yours
[10:37:06] <jymmmm> Loetmichel: you and your family might need it
[10:37:39] <jymmmm> Loetmichel: when the numbers of infected start to decline, then maybe that's another story.
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[10:39:48] <Tom_L> Loetmichel, i use one similar and it works but i leave it turned down as low as i can and still siphon the coolant
[10:40:01] <Tom_L> http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81
[10:40:28] <Loetmichel> Jymmm: we have enough desinfectant. i have that IPA at home for cleaning poirposes
[10:40:35] <Tom_L> i did have to add an extra O-ring to the tip so it wouldn't vibrate off
[10:41:13] <Loetmichel> and for milling alu
[10:41:42] <jymmmm> Loetmichel: Ok, fair enough.
[10:41:46] <Tom_L> i've got an exhaust fan in that corner if it gets too bad
[10:41:56] <Tom_L> but i've not had to use it very often
[10:41:57] <Loetmichel> i doubt we will run out of desinfectant. just pisses me off that we have apparently some coworkers that cant say anything when a jug is empty and let me reorder that stuff
[10:42:56] <Loetmichel> Tom_L: looks ok to me. so its useable but not as good as a real fogbuster?
[10:43:41] <gregcnc> the needle valve in those are utter garbage
[10:43:48] <Tom_L> agreed
[10:43:50] <Loetmichel> as my machines are both in an enclosure and the vacuum table will suck out nearly 100% of the aerosol and thru the shopvac filter i doubt any aerosol wold be a problem
[10:44:12] <gregcnc> alcohol or oil?
[10:44:23] <Loetmichel> https://www.youtube.com
[10:44:39] <Loetmichel> usually a mix of alcohol, water and a dab of dish detergent
[10:44:41] <Tom_L> i'm using regular coolant in mine
[10:44:52] <Loetmichel> the link above are the two machines here now
[10:45:07] <Tom_L> the jug should be somewhat level with the nozzle as it is a siphon thing
[10:45:20] <Loetmichel> coolant doesent work THAt well for alu, also its a mess you have to clean off with solvents
[10:45:20] <Tom_L> i set mine on the table beside the mill
[10:45:42] <Loetmichel> the water/alcohol mix you just have to put under running water and they are squeaky clean again
[10:46:20] <Loetmichel> if needed i can putt the coolant jug on the back of the machine
[10:46:32] <Loetmichel> enclosure. from the inside
[10:46:45] <Loetmichel> to match the nozzle height
[10:46:58] <Tom_L> http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81
[10:47:31] <Tom_L> you can see the location of the mixed jug to the left there
[10:49:41] <Tom_L> for $10 or whatever it was i didn't expect much but it does ok
[10:51:52] <Tom_L> https://www.ebay.de
[10:52:01] <Tom_L> mine is more like that one with the fatter tip
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[11:07:05] <miss0r> Tom_L: Imagine comming in just now and reading your last message out of context...
[11:07:29] <miss0r> I think I need some sleep :) I've been going at it for almost 30 hours straight now. See you around
[11:10:40] <jymmmm> miss0r slave don't get to sleep, get your ass back to work
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[11:18:35] <Loetmichel> Tom_L: thanks
[11:19:05] <Loetmichel> i will order two and when i get them i will give feeedback how they work for me
[11:29:19] <Loetmichel> hmm, anyone knows a high flex air line that will fit those 8mm "plug in" air fittings so that i can use the energy chains on my machines for the air line?
[11:32:48] <gregcnc> the reinforced type should work
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[11:40:23] <Loetmichel> gregcnc: i ment those fittings that you just shove the air line (usually hard plastic) in and it holds by means of some sheet metal teeth inside and an o-ring
[11:40:54] <Loetmichel> not the usual barbs you put the hose on the OUTside of and put a hose clamp around
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[11:47:25] <gregcnc> and those hoses don't work with push connect fittings?
[11:48:15] <gregcnc> or change the fittings
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[11:49:15] <gregcnc> or https://www.mcmaster.com
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[12:19:25] <Loetmichel> gregcnc: https://www.ebay.de
[12:19:28] <Loetmichel> Those fittings
[12:19:45] <gregcnc> reread above
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[12:21:46] <Loetmichel> point is that i have no idea IF there are hoses that are high flex that work
[12:21:57] <Loetmichel> the usual hoses for those fittings are stiff as hell
[12:22:25] <jymmmm> I'm curious, I'm looking at small mylar food grade bags, but one side is clear (see through), doesn't that defeat the purpose?
[12:22:45] <Loetmichel> that was my point, to ask if there are hoses that fit but are flexible enough for energy chains or if i have go short, stiff hose in the fitting, barb adater, flexible hose
[12:23:15] <Loetmichel> which pourpose?
[12:23:20] <Loetmichel> @ Jymmm
[12:23:49] <jymmmm> Loetmichel: foodstuff
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[12:24:31] <Loetmichel> which pourpose? to have it fresh?
[12:24:44] <Loetmichel> why shouldnt clear mylar dont do that? its still airtight
[12:24:56] <gregcnc> https://www.festo.com
[12:25:21] <jymmmm> Loetmichel: long term storage. IDK, I'm asking, seems that ALL foil would be better for that task
[12:25:23] <Loetmichel> metallized mylar is used for helum ballons because helium is a lot thinner than air, so that it cant escape as easy
[12:26:03] <jymmmm> Loetmichel: Example: https://www.amazon.com
[12:26:27] <gregcnc> the zip defeats teh purpose
[12:27:55] <Loetmichel> Jymmm: yes, the alu coating there is just for optical reasons
[12:27:56] <jymmmm> gregcnc: I plan on heat sealing
[12:28:05] <Loetmichel> not for any "keep it fresh"
[12:28:17] <Loetmichel> it would work just the same with a totally clear bag
[12:28:23] <Loetmichel> unless its light sensitive
[12:29:04] <jymmmm> Loetmichel: Ok, then whats the big deal about mylar compared to PP/PE bags?
[12:29:41] <Loetmichel> no idea, i would assume more cold resistant/resistant to tearing.
[12:29:57] <Loetmichel> so not easily spoied foods because of handling the bags
[12:30:10] <Loetmichel> spoiled/ice burned
[12:33:49] <jymmmm> I had the belief that better edge sealed, and air leeching, thus why I quetion the clear side
[12:35:18] <gregcnc> how long are you storing this food for?
[12:36:06] <Loetmichel> the bags i have for vacuum sealing stuff at the company are made of PE. and have a microstructured foil on one inside so the air can always escapbe
[12:36:32] <Loetmichel> they do just fine to seal in silver based RF gaskets for 10+ years. should work the same time for foods
[12:37:46] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org <- there you can see our two apprentices and the machine/bags
[12:39:19] <pink_vampire> "flux density in the infrared regime of 7 yocto nanomaggies" someone can help me to convert it to Celsius?
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[12:43:20] <Loetmichel> Jymmm: as i said above: that metal coating isnt doing anything better than clear plastic foil. Other than preventing UV degradation, but that should be minimal for stored foods, those are usually NOT stored in the sun
[12:43:28] <Loetmichel> outside i mean
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[12:47:38] <jymmmm> Loetmichel: Well, I'm also talking air, moisture, etc not just light penitration. I mena why are HDD's packed in mylar bags?
[12:51:30] <gregcnc> HDD are not prepper food, so I don't know
[12:52:09] <gregcnc> does your food also need to be ESD safe?
[12:52:29] <jymmmm> gregcnc: Is that all you use mylar bags for? preper food? lol
[12:53:15] <gregcnc> i just had some scorpion pepper cheese out of a metlaizer mylar bag. I suspect it could combust with ESD
[12:53:40] <jymmmm> I woulddddd too! lol
[12:53:57] <gregcnc> just about right for heat
[12:54:29] <gregcnc> plus side, nobody else in the house will eat my snack
[12:54:49] <jymmmm> That's not a snack, that's just you being a masocist =)
[12:55:38] <gregcnc> something is wrong with me. I don't know icecream headache either
[12:56:05] <jymmmm> Other than the ESD aspects, I'm just trying to figure out why ppl are packing in mylar bags compred to (let's say) those food saver food bags
[12:56:24] <jymmmm> IS it just avilabaility?
[12:56:55] <gregcnc> you need to look at moisture and oxygen permeability
[12:57:09] <jymmmm> And every mylar bag I see on amazon says ""smell proof"
[12:57:12] <gregcnc> a lot of stuff is multiple layers
[12:57:37] <gregcnc> amazon marketing....
[12:57:47] <jymmmm> gregcnc: Right, but I can't find specs specific to "mylar bags" other than heresay
[12:58:02] <gregcnc> go to the source
[13:00:31] <jymmmm> gregcnc: Wholesale Only! Down for maintenance
[13:00:49] <jymmmm> gregcnc: mylarbags.com that is =)
[13:01:00] <jymmmm> lmao
[13:01:18] <gregcnc> I read about the stuff years ago, spec from the mfg for something non food related
[13:02:47] <gregcnc> https://www.newsweek.com
[13:03:13] <jymmmm> An alernate example is the "survival bars" that are USCG approved, but those bags are foil, not mylar
[13:07:45] <gregcnc> "foil"
[13:10:19] <Tom_L> Loetmichel, i used a regular pipe fitting on mine
[13:10:36] <Tom_L> 1/8" ? NPT
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[13:11:55] <jymmmm> gregcnc: thus the "mylar foil" aspects. I know it's multiple layers, but layers of what?
[13:11:58] <Loetmichel> Jymmm: HDDs are packed into mylar bags because its easily metallized (ESD) and sturdy enough wo not rip up on sharp corners of the drive
[13:12:16] <Loetmichel> a PE or PP bag with conductivity would work just the same
[13:12:36] <jymmmm> Loetmichel: ok, and the oxygen absorber they toss in the hdd bags too
[13:12:45] <Loetmichel> thats not oxygen
[13:12:50] <Loetmichel> its moisture absorber
[13:12:57] <gregcnc> https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
[13:13:05] <Rab> jymmmm, I believe the aluminum layer is vapor-deposited, given that you can usually see through it.
[13:13:18] <jymmmm> Rab: ah ok
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[13:14:13] <Tom_L> Loetmichel, i didn't use the push connector, rather a short piece of airline with a quick connect on it
[13:14:14] <jymmmm> gregcnc: what is "EPP"
[13:14:20] <Rab> However I have never found conductivity, or noticed scratching on a typical mylar antistatic bag. So it might be two laminated layers, with the aluminized film inside.
[13:14:32] <Tom_L> Enhanced Parallel Port?
[13:14:51] <jymmmm> Tom_L in the link gregcnc gave
[13:14:59] <gregcnc> scroll to the top
[13:15:00] <Tom_L> O
[13:15:13] <Loetmichel> Tom_L: on the version i have ordered the push connector is part of the needle valves
[13:15:13] <Tom_L> sry been outside
[13:15:20] <Loetmichel> so not easily replaced
[13:15:33] <Tom_L> i think mine came with one but i didn't use it
[13:15:47] <jymmmm> Tom_L no worries =)
[13:16:00] <Loetmichel> jymmmm: "enhanced polyproplene" in your context IIRC
[13:16:11] <jymmmm> Loetmichel: ah ok
[13:17:13] <gregcnc> my link said EFP emergency food product or those USCG survival bars
[13:18:15] <Loetmichel> Tom_L: https://www.ebay.de
[13:18:23] <Loetmichel> look at the pictures in that link
[13:18:41] <Loetmichel> seems the push connector is part of the needle valve housing
[13:18:57] <gregcnc> it is
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[13:22:48] <jymmmm> Loetmichel: gregcnc OH, it said EFP, not EPP. -- Emergency Food Product
[13:25:38] <jymmmm> damn Times New Roman
[13:28:43] <Loetmichel> ah!
[13:28:49] <Loetmichel> hihi
[13:29:01] <jymmmm> =)
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[13:30:04] <Loetmichel> gregcnc: so you would say: option is a short piece of rigid hose into that connector, a second connector with adapter to barb, and then a high flex hose?
[13:30:18] <Loetmichel> on the cooland sprayer
[13:30:26] <Loetmichel> -d+t
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[13:43:52] <jymmmm> the trilaminate currently used by the military is recommended (from inside to outside: 0.003- to 0.004-in thick polyolefin/0.00035- to 0.00078-in thick aluminum foil/0.0005-in thick polyester [Natick Research, Development, and Engineering Center, 1993]). Other laminations with the recommended properties are also applicable, including the enhanced laminate currently recommended by the military that uses both polyester and nylon f
[13:43:52] <jymmmm> or additional protection against distribution (mechanical) forces. The package should be nitrogen flushed, and residual oxygen must not exceed 0.5 percent .
[13:46:00] <Tom_L> Loetmichel, mine is slightly different
[13:47:03] <Loetmichel> yeah, i have seen your link
[13:47:20] <Tom_L> it did have that connector but was a pipe fitting
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[14:02:41] <gregcnc> leotmichel, I don't know what your needs are. the festo doc seemed to have 8mm od tube with ~25mm bend radius. the barb adapter plugs directly into the push connector
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[15:22:54] <adamj12b> Hi guys, Working on upgrading the mobo in my mill and had to pick up a 6i25 to replace the 5i25. Im running into a strange issue that any configuration using the 6i25 that trys to start, the computer locks up solid and I have to do a hard reboot. Any suggestions?
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[15:28:27] <burklefoo> What does lspci | grep 2718 show?
[15:34:11] <adamj12b> burklefoo 02:00.0 DPIO module: Device 2178:5i25 )rev 01)
[15:34:37] <adamj12b> minus the typo... (rev 01)
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[15:38:27] <adamj12b> kern.log doesn't even show what happens...
[15:41:47] <burklefoo> does "sudo mesaflash --device 5i25 --readhmid" work?
[15:43:42] <adamj12b> let me try
[15:43:48] <Tom_L> pretty sure they both use the same config
[15:44:59] <adamj12b> Yes, it does work.
[15:45:18] <adamj12b> Returns the config, modules and pinout
[15:45:36] <burklefoo> Recent LinuxCNC?
[15:45:47] <adamj12b> I loaded and verified the 5i25_7i77x2.bat
[15:45:56] <adamj12b> Yes. 2.8.0pre01
[15:46:13] <adamj12b> it is one of the images that Rob built recently
[15:46:16] <adamj12b> RTAI kernel
[15:46:36] <adamj12b> Mint 19.2
[15:47:36] <adamj12b> BeagleBrainz on the forums
[15:48:18] <burklefoo> Strange, looks like the low level hardware works
[15:49:33] <Rab> adamj12b, is anything plugged into the I/O yet?
[15:49:43] <adamj12b> Yea its very weird. The computer has passed every test I could throw at it, and I go to move the config over and its not happy.
[15:50:06] <adamj12b> No, its just the card in the PCIe slot. The whole mobo is sitting on my desk.
[15:50:34] <adamj12b> I was just trying to get the config moved over and error out when it couldn't find the 7i77 but I cant get that far.
[15:51:06] <burklefoo> Can you try a quick test on a Preempt-RT system? (just a USB live image should work)
[15:51:23] <burklefoo> (say the stretch live image)
[15:51:52] <adamj12b> I have a ton of images I can try. I can do that but it will take a few minutes.
[15:52:06] <adamj12b> I went with RTAI because the latency was amazingly good.
[15:52:50] <adamj12b> 11us with rtai and 78us with preempt, but preempt has much better FPS running GLXgears.
[15:53:23] <burklefoo> Right but latency is basically irrelevant once you have interface hardware
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[15:53:31] <adamj12b> My mill runs 4 axis servos in torque mode so it is very processor intense. I was hoping to run a 4khz servo thread and in testing this mobo can do it.
[15:54:51] <adamj12b> the strech live iso was one of the highest latency in all my testing. but I will try that first as its the most official. Standby
[15:55:04] <burklefoo> 4KHz should be possible with 78 us (you would also need to do a latency test with a 4 KHz servo and no base thread to know)
[15:55:40] <adamj12b> It gets 78us at 1k and 4k
[15:55:59] <adamj12b> and graphics are better so i dont mind, but the mill is my main production machine.
[15:56:21] <adamj12b> Its solid now, but is hurting with 3FPS screen updates when running large programs
[15:57:03] <burklefoo> Yeah I think some of the recent RTAI images disable video acceleration
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[15:57:57] <burklefoo> (you might get better Preempt-RT latency if you disabled video engine access also)
[15:58:47] <adamj12b> if preempt fixes it, I will look into that
[15:59:27] <burklefoo> Right I'm mainly suggesting this as a way to bisect the crash issue
[16:00:36] <veegee> Hey all, I'm looking for a "right angle adapter" for my bridgeport
[16:01:00] <veegee> don't know what they're called exactly
[16:01:02] <adamj12b> ok so I dont have stretch on a flash drive but I have mint 19.2 XFCE and Preempt kernel
[16:01:05] <adamj12b> this works.
[16:01:16] <veegee> pretty much something that makes the vertical R8 into a horizontal
[16:01:40] <veegee> so I can machine stuff into the ends of large lumber
[16:02:00] <veegee> doesn't need to be the most rigid thing ever because it's used to machine wood
[16:02:14] <veegee> anyone have any ideas?
[16:03:39] <XXCoder> you man, turn into horzional mill?
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[16:32:39] <unterhaus> there are right angle adapters for bridgeports.
[16:34:42] <unterhaus> https://eisenm.com
[16:35:17] <unterhaus> the machine shop at work (RIP) had a BP one.
[16:37:59] <unterhaus> some people on ebay are overly proud of them though
[16:41:02] <Tom_L> and you thought you were having a bad day: https://youtu.be
[16:42:24] <XXCoder> honestly i think those was overloaded
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[17:00:35] <Deejay> gn8
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[17:05:38] <_unreal_> hello
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[17:22:47] <unterhaus> you can d/l ventilator plans from medtronic
[17:23:11] <unterhaus> https://www.medtronic.com
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[17:34:06] <methods_> ah cool
[17:34:09] <methods_> thx for linkie
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[17:58:13] <adamj12b> ok, another question. I moved back to preempt and when I do the latency test, its ok, about 77us. When I run a sim, I get the unexpected realtime delay error....
[18:01:08] <andypugh> Is the sim loading a base thread ?
[18:01:14] <adamj12b> yes
[18:01:21] <adamj12b> its a stock sim
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[18:04:44] <andypugh> 76µs might be a bit long for a base thread. But it’s not a problem for a 6i25.
[18:05:17] <adamj12b> What is your opinion of trying to run a 4khz servo thread with that 76us?
[18:05:24] <andypugh> Of course, I might be wrongly assuming that you are the same uy as the one on the forum with a 76µs latency who has switched back to the preempt-rt kernel.
[18:05:43] <adamj12b> on robs thread?? yes
[18:05:52] <andypugh> All I can say is “try it”
[18:06:10] <andypugh> It will also come down to the execution time of the thread.
[18:06:18] <adamj12b> rtai had 11us max latency but did not like the 6i25
[18:06:42] <andypugh> Which specific kernel? 4.25.174 ?
[18:06:50] <adamj12b> 11us when running a 4khz latency test
[18:06:53] <andypugh> 4.14.174 I mean.
[18:06:57] <adamj12b> standby I noted everything
[18:07:07] <adamj12b> 4.14.148-rtai-amd64
[18:07:27] <adamj12b> I was thinking about rebuilding the kernel to see if that helped...
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[18:07:41] <andypugh> You could try the 174, but it’s probably identical.
[18:08:18] <andypugh> The set of .debs on www.linuxcnc.org/temp should install straight over the top.
[18:09:17] <pcw_mesa> Not sure if 64 bit RTAI kernels have been tested on the 5I25/6I25
[18:10:13] <adamj12b> I was talking to burklefoo on IRC earlier and he was talking about disabling hardware acceleration on the preempt install to try and help the latency.
[18:10:44] <adamj12b> pcw_mesa it locks up the computer and doesnt even kernel panic or write anything to kern.log
[18:10:54] <andypugh> pcw_mesa: It works for me….
[18:11:25] <andypugh> I can’t recall off-hand if it’s a 5i25 or 6i25 in the test machine.
[18:11:28] <pcw_mesa> Same Kernel?
[18:11:33] <andypugh> Yes.
[18:11:41] <andypugh> Hmm. Maybe not.
[18:11:47] <adamj12b> different build though?
[18:12:11] <andypugh> I can’t guarantee that I actually tried 4.14.148 with the PCI card.
[18:12:27] <andypugh> But 4.14.174 definitely works.
[18:12:29] <adamj12b> I can reinstall rtai real quick. only takes about 10 mins.
[18:12:51] <pcw_mesa> adamj12b: will wheezy work on you hardware?
[18:13:14] <adamj12b> I have not tried.
[18:13:38] <Tom_L> it's EOL but alot of guys are still using it.. me for one
[18:13:38] <adamj12b> I was trying BeagleBrainz mint images instead of building my own.
[18:13:52] <pcw_mesa> might be one way until the new RTAI issue is sorted
[18:13:55] <adamj12b> I did try stretch but the latency was the worst of any iso I tried.
[18:14:15] <Tom_L> stretch with preempt will want newer hardware
[18:14:22] <adamj12b> pcw_mesa Maybe you can answer a specific question what could choose a direction.
[18:15:08] <adamj12b> My machine is 4 axis torque mode servos. I want to run a faster loop then 1khz thats one reason for upgrading. RTAI handles 4khz in sim and had 11us latency.
[18:15:39] <Tom_L> what os?
[18:15:40] <pcw_mesa> Not sure that sim timing means _anything_
[18:15:53] <adamj12b> Preempt is around 76-120us.
[18:16:00] <adamj12b> Tom_L Mint 19.2
[18:16:40] <pcw_mesa> I would just try Preempt-RT
[18:17:07] <pcw_mesa> maybe reduce your servo thread to 3 KHz if need be
[18:17:36] <adamj12b> ok.
[18:17:49] <adamj12b> well 3khz will be better then 1khz.
[18:18:01] <pcw_mesa> Do you have the normal boot settings that improve latency? (idle=poll, etc)
[18:18:28] <adamj12b> I am using robs image currently and would have to check.
[18:18:50] <pcw_mesa> what pc hardware?
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[18:19:29] <adamj12b> Asrock Q1900B-ITX 2.0GHZ 8GB DDR3 Crucial memory and 32GB Transcend SSD
[18:19:53] <pcw_mesa> Yeah those are not stellar with Preempt-RT
[18:20:06] <adamj12b> the 1900?
[18:20:20] <pcw_mesa> do you have speed switching turned off in the BIOS?
[18:20:38] <adamj12b> I have everythig turned off in bios...
[18:20:48] <adamj12b> I upgraded bios which helped a bit.
[18:21:11] <pcw_mesa> Yeah most of the fanless chips are not great with Preempt-RT
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[18:24:19] <adamj12b> Thats basically what my tests confirm too...
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[18:25:08] <adamj12b> any suggestions on how to get rtai working? Ive built a few kernels before, but im still newer at it. would building on the hardware help?
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[18:29:14] <andypugh> There are config changes you can make.
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[18:29:45] <adamj12b> pcw_mesa correct me if im wrong, but the only command line argument in the grub file is GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX_DEFAULT="quiet splash"
[18:29:46] <andypugh> Almost-complete instructions are here: https://github.com
[18:30:26] <adamj12b> I should add idle=poll here correct?
[18:33:46] <Tom_L> adamj12b, i'm running an asrock 1900 with wheezy and RTAI
[18:34:12] <adamj12b> Tom_L What mesa interface?
[18:34:29] <pcw_mesa> adamj12b: yes
[18:34:53] <Tom_L> mine is the 7i90 parallel interface
[18:35:11] <Tom_L> but pci would be better yet i'd think
[18:35:17] <adamj12b> pcw_mesa just " idle=poll" with a space?
[18:35:25] <pcw_mesa> this is what I have on one machine:
[18:35:27] <pcw_mesa> GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX_DEFAULT=" isolcpus=3 i915.enable_rc6=0 i915.enable_dc=0 i915.
[18:35:28] <pcw_mesa> semaphores=1 idle=poll quiet splash"
[18:35:30] <adamj12b> Tom_L What kernel version and are you 64 bit?
[18:35:32] <andypugh> adamj12b: I once had a problem with one of my CNC machines where the 5i25 caused a crash like you describe. But _only_ when it was connected via a particular right-angle header. It’s been running fine for about 10 years with a _different_ right-angle header.
[18:35:44] <Tom_L> adamj12b, i'd have to go check
[18:35:55] <Tom_L> it's likely 32 bit
[18:36:00] <andypugh> Wheezy RTAI is 32 bit
[18:36:24] <adamj12b> andypugh this is right on the mobo so thats not it.
[18:36:29] <Tom_L> pretty sure JT is still using it on at least one machine as well
[18:37:11] <andypugh> My actual CNC machines are probably still on Wheezy. If not Lucid :-)
[18:37:47] <Tom_L> mine works good, i see no reason to change it
[18:37:51] <andypugh> And I suspect both are using some ancient dev version of LinuxCNC too.
[18:38:03] <Tom_L> iirc i'm using 2.8
[18:38:15] <andypugh> I think the lathe is running the eoffsets-dev branch.
[18:38:42] <Tom_L> 2.7 or 2.8, i know i've tested both
[18:39:16] <adamj12b> ok I changed GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX_DEFAULT="quiet splash" to GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX_DEFAULT="quiet splash idle=poll" and updated grub and rebooted
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[19:22:37] <adamj12b> So changing the arguments to this made a world of difference GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX_DEFAULT="quiet splash isolcpus=3 processor.maxcstate=1 idle=poll"
[19:24:17] <adamj12b> Idle=poll and processpr.maxcstate=1 made some difference, about 10us. adding isolcpus=3 dropped the max latency, while running 4khz loop and 4 glx gears, down to 8.2us.
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[19:37:21] <Tom_L> adamj12b, this was with mint19 and stretch?
[19:38:55] <Tom_L> on the asrock 1900?
[19:39:24] <Tom_L> i might have to try buster on it one of these days and see
[19:41:50] <adamj12b> Tom_L Yes Asrock 1900 and mint 19.2 with rt-preempt.
[19:42:21] <Tom_L> cool
[19:42:45] <adamj12b> https://forum.linuxcnc.org
[19:42:57] <Tom_L> where do you put those arguments?
[19:43:10] <adamj12b> thats the iso I used iso I used
[19:43:27] <adamj12b> in the grub file. /etc/default/grub
[19:43:41] <Tom_L> hmm
[19:43:55] <Tom_L> i'd be curious what buster would do on it now
[19:47:44] <adamj12b> Tom_L https://drive.google.com
[19:50:50] <Tom_L> nice
[19:51:41] <adamj12b> Yea! I think Im ready to move ahead with installing the new mobo in the mill tomorrow.
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[23:08:32] <_unreal_> well I didnt get much done tonight
[23:09:05] <Tom_L> i don't feel so bad then
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